Community
Participate
Working Groups
The view menu chevron icon should be replaced by the modern hamburger icon which is universally used for additional menu or settings. The chevron icon is Eclipse specific and people have a hard time finding the view menu.
Created attachment 280084 [details] Hamburger menu 1
Created attachment 280085 [details] Hamburger menu 2
+0 If we do this it must be on the right as this is the place for the hamburger menu.
-1 I found both new icons not looking like a "classic" hamburger icon. Both the idea itself sounds interesting.
(In reply to Andrey Loskutov from comment #4) > -1 > I found both new icons not looking like a "classic" hamburger icon. > Both the idea itself sounds interesting. We have not much room to work with. Maybe Matthias can take look at this? This idea was triggered by Matthias' work on bug 466511 and the fact that people can't find the view menu (e.g. the discussion surrounding the Navigator deprecation [1]) [1] https://twitter.com/vogella/status/1174985466325716992
Matthias, WDYT?
The idea did grow on me. Wim, if you need an good icon, maybe the Android one can be used? https://material.io/resources/icons/?search=menu&icon=menu&style=baseline
(In reply to Wim Jongman from comment #6) > Matthias, WDYT? The idea with the hamburger is not bad. Drawing that should not be that hard...
(In reply to Matthias Becker from comment #8) > (In reply to Wim Jongman from comment #6) > > Matthias, WDYT? > > The idea with the hamburger is not bad. Drawing that should not be that > hard... Thanks. IMO, you would be the best man for this after your work on 466511. Do you want to take it?
On the Qwant app, the humburger is replaced by 3 vertical bold dots, like "dot dot dot" but vertically. I like it a lot as 1. it reminds me of the hamburger we see on other places 2. it reminds me of "dot dot dot" like "there's more here" 3. it's slimer than the hamburger. But actually, I'm wondering whether just a "..." label could be a good solution for this case.
(In reply to Mickael Istria from comment #10) > On the Qwant app, the humburger is replaced by 3 vertical bold dots, like > "dot dot dot" but vertically. I like it a lot as > 1. it reminds me of the hamburger we see on other places > 2. it reminds me of "dot dot dot" like "there's more here" > 3. it's slimer than the hamburger. > > But actually, I'm wondering whether just a "..." label could be a good > solution for this case. I think we need a more "in your face" approach and the hamburger is perfect for that. The three ways of presenting a menu (4 if you count the chevron) could be a preference setting at some point.
(In reply to Wim Jongman from comment #11) that. > > The three ways of presenting a menu (4 if you count the chevron) could be a > preference setting at some point. -1, we have already way to much preference. If we want a configurable view menu, we should support this via CSS.
Created attachment 280135 [details] Google style I discussed with Matthias and I am taking this. I have created a png from the icon svg Lars pointed me to.
(In reply to Wim Jongman from comment #13) > Created attachment 280135 [details] > Google style > > I discussed with Matthias and I am taking this. > > I have created a png from the icon svg Lars pointed me to. Cool. Any change that this goes to the right end?
(In reply to Wim Jongman from comment #13) > Created attachment 280135 [details] > Google style > > I discussed with Matthias and I am taking this. > > I have created a png from the icon svg Lars pointed me to. I think the color should be the same as the other icons next to it.
(In reply to Lars Vogel from comment #14) > > Cool. Any change that this goes to the right end? I will take a look at the minmax code but I'm afraid that this is a separate bug.
(In reply to Matthias Becker from comment #15) > > I think the color should be the same as the other icons next to it. I did that in the two attachments below but got a -1 in comment #4 https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/attachment.cgi?id=280085 https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/attachment.cgi?id=280084
(In reply to Wim Jongman from comment #17) > (In reply to Matthias Becker from comment #15) > > > > > I think the color should be the same as the other icons next to it. > > I did that in the two attachments below but got a -1 in comment #4 > > https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/attachment.cgi?id=280085 > https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/attachment.cgi?id=280084 I will look at that again
(In reply to Matthias Becker from comment #15) > I think the color should be the same as the other icons next to it. This requires that https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=495033 gets solved (currently assigned to Matthias, otherwise the color of min-max depends on the OS)
(In reply to Lars Vogel from comment #19) > (In reply to Matthias Becker from comment #15) > > I think the color should be the same as the other icons next to it. > > This requires that https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=495033 gets > solved (currently assigned to Matthias, otherwise the color of min-max > depends on the OS) That's not true. See: https://git.eclipse.org/r/#/c/140607 The color no longer is OS dependent.
(In reply to Wim Jongman from comment #17) > (In reply to Matthias Becker from comment #15) > > > > > I think the color should be the same as the other icons next to it. > > I did that in the two attachments below but got a -1 in comment #4 > > https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/attachment.cgi?id=280085 > https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/attachment.cgi?id=280084 I would give a +1 ;-)
(In reply to Matthias Becker from comment #20) > That's not true. See: https://git.eclipse.org/r/#/c/140607 > The color no longer is OS dependent. I think that was only for the view menu. AFAIK Min/ Max button from Bug 495033 still is still OS dependent
(In reply to Lars Vogel from comment #22) > (In reply to Matthias Becker from comment #20) > > > That's not true. See: https://git.eclipse.org/r/#/c/140607 > > The color no longer is OS dependent. > > I think that was only for the view menu. > AFAIK Min/ Max button from Bug 495033 still is still OS dependent At Wim: Can you pls. verify this?
Created attachment 280142 [details] light theme
Created attachment 280143 [details] Dark theme
(In reply to Wim Jongman from comment #25) > Created attachment 280143 [details] > Dark theme +1
Created attachment 280144 [details] vetical dots For completeness, the vertical dots. I'm not sure how to get these looking good in both dark and light themes.
(In reply to Wim Jongman from comment #27) > Created attachment 280144 [details] > vetical dots > > For completeness, the vertical dots. I'm not sure how to get these looking > good in both dark and light themes. Looks better than stripes.
(In reply to Wim Jongman from comment #27) > For completeness, the vertical dots. I'm not sure how to get these looking > good in both dark and light themes. I like them better than other proposals.
(In reply to Mickael Istria from comment #29) > (In reply to Wim Jongman from comment #27) > > For completeness, the vertical dots. I'm not sure how to get these looking > > good in both dark and light themes. > > I like them better than other proposals. So far me too.
Removed milestone as no one reacted to https://www.eclipse.org/lists/eclipse-dev/msg11217.html.
@Wim: is there any technical blocker about adoption of the vertical dots? If not, can you please push a Gerrit patch?
New Gerrit change created: https://git.eclipse.org/r/151048
New Gerrit change created: https://git.eclipse.org/r/151050
Thanks Wim. Unless there is an objection, I'll probably merge those 2 patches tomorrow. In worst case, they're trivial to revert.
Created attachment 280249 [details] Final dots Here is the submitted version of the icon that works with dark and light themes.
(In reply to Mickael Istria from comment #35) > Thanks Wim. > Unless there is an objection, I'll probably merge those 2 patches tomorrow. > In worst case, they're trivial to revert. I was thinking to merge now so that we have them tomorrow.
(In reply to Wim Jongman from comment #36) > Created attachment 280249 [details] > Final dots > > Here is the submitted version of the icon that works with dark and light > themes. BTW, this is the hires version. If you are watching it in the browser, resize to 50%.
(In reply to Wim Jongman from comment #37) > (In reply to Mickael Istria from comment #35) > > Thanks Wim. > > Unless there is an objection, I'll probably merge those 2 patches tomorrow. > > In worst case, they're trivial to revert. > > I was thinking to merge now so that we have them tomorrow. Ok, let's do it!
Gerrit change https://git.eclipse.org/r/151048 was merged to [master]. Commit: http://git.eclipse.org/c/platform/eclipse.platform.images.git/commit/?id=f0a033e3084b0a89db1b6e015911201a6d48e88e
Gerrit change https://git.eclipse.org/r/151050 was merged to [master]. Commit: http://git.eclipse.org/c/platform/eclipse.platform.ui.git/commit/?id=569a5e38555f3c3a5aa38cf2dc46d1bda24f884e
I merged the patches. @Wim: can you please prepare a N&N entry for this? I think this kind of UX improvements moving to lighter and more standard icons are worth it.
New Gerrit change created: https://git.eclipse.org/r/151052
(In reply to Eclipse Genie from comment #43) > New Gerrit change created: https://git.eclipse.org/r/151052 Added EPL license to the svg. Not sure if that is important. (In reply to Mickael Istria from comment #42) > @Wim: can you please prepare a N&N entry for this? I think this kind of UX > improvements moving to lighter and more standard icons are worth it. Yes.
Gerrit change https://git.eclipse.org/r/151052 was merged to [master]. Commit: http://git.eclipse.org/c/platform/eclipse.platform.images.git/commit/?id=bc2d07f14bf012384785403d4ad96f19052bc18f
New Gerrit change created: https://git.eclipse.org/r/151074
Gerrit change https://git.eclipse.org/r/151074 was merged to [master]. Commit: http://git.eclipse.org/c/www.eclipse.org/eclipse/news.git/commit/?id=ca058f5c2cf3c84dc709bf5636ca9619060b5955
Created attachment 280272 [details] live screenshot (In reply to Eclipse Genie from comment #47) > Gerrit change https://git.eclipse.org/r/151074 was merged to [master]. > Commit: > http://git.eclipse.org/c/www.eclipse.org/eclipse/news.git/commit/ > ?id=ca058f5c2cf3c84dc709bf5636ca9619060b5955 I found that the new icon has too low contrast, especially on grey background. They are hardly recognizable as button. So can we please update the icons?
(In reply to Eclipse Genie from comment #47) > Gerrit change https://git.eclipse.org/r/151074 was merged to [master]. > Commit: > http://git.eclipse.org/c/www.eclipse.org/eclipse/news.git/commit/ > ?id=ca058f5c2cf3c84dc709bf5636ca9619060b5955 Lot of validation errors introduced by this entry, Please fix it.
(In reply to Sarika Sinha from comment #49) > Lot of validation errors introduced by this entry, Please fix it. Where?
(In reply to Sarika Sinha from comment #49) > (In reply to Eclipse Genie from comment #47) > > Gerrit change https://git.eclipse.org/r/151074 was merged to [master]. > > Commit: > > http://git.eclipse.org/c/www.eclipse.org/eclipse/news.git/commit/ > > ?id=ca058f5c2cf3c84dc709bf5636ca9619060b5955 > > Lot of validation errors introduced by this entry, Please fix it. Can these errors be integrated into a gerrit build?
(In reply to Andrey Loskutov from comment #48) > They are hardly recognizable as button. So can we please update the icons? I'm on it.
(In reply to Wim Jongman from comment #50) > (In reply to Sarika Sinha from comment #49) > > > Lot of validation errors introduced by this entry, Please fix it. > > Where? You can see the errors if you put the content of platform.html in https://validator.w3.org/#validate_by_input It will be great if it can be validated by gerrit, we can create a bug.
New Gerrit change created: https://git.eclipse.org/r/151153
Created attachment 280279 [details] More contrast and bigger Here a version with more contrast. I also made it a bit bigger.
(In reply to Wim Jongman from comment #55) > Created attachment 280279 [details] > More contrast and bigger > > Here a version with more contrast. I also made it a bit bigger. What do the different parts show? I don't understand your screenshot.
Created attachment 280280 [details] Alternative What about solid dot's like "WhatsApp Web" does use?
(In reply to Wim Jongman from comment #55) > Created attachment 280279 [details] > More contrast and bigger > > Here a version with more contrast. I also made it a bit bigger. Yes, looks better. (In reply to Matthias Becker from comment #57) > Created attachment 280280 [details] > Alternative > > What about solid dot's like "WhatsApp Web" does use? Can we have it "in the IDE", similar to the screenshot from Wim? Or as a patch?
(In reply to Matthias Becker from comment #56) > > What do the different parts show? I don't understand your screenshot. It shows how the icon looks in hi and lo resolution in dark and light themes
(In reply to Matthias Becker from comment #57) > Created attachment 280280 [details] > Alternative > > What about solid dot's like "WhatsApp Web" does use? No can do. We have to use contrasting colors to make one icon it look good in the different themes. We can't switch icons based on the theme.
New Gerrit change created: https://git.eclipse.org/r/151176
New Gerrit change created: https://git.eclipse.org/r/151177
Created attachment 280283 [details] contrast OK, but a bit fuzzy now (In reply to Eclipse Genie from comment #62) > New Gerrit change created: https://git.eclipse.org/r/151177 Looks better now from contrast point of view, but it is a bit "fuzzy" on my screen (non-hi-dpi). Not sure if that can be made better though.
Gerrit change https://git.eclipse.org/r/151153 was merged to [master]. Commit: http://git.eclipse.org/c/www.eclipse.org/eclipse/news.git/commit/?id=da2e989639ce1063ab31fab153c8b953d33d9034
Gerrit change https://git.eclipse.org/r/151177 was merged to [master]. Commit: http://git.eclipse.org/c/platform/eclipse.platform.ui.git/commit/?id=ee5f8d5c971db2ab9aa5459c416506c3aa7e094d
New Gerrit change created: https://git.eclipse.org/r/151184
New Gerrit change created: https://git.eclipse.org/r/151185
Created attachment 280284 [details] Different SVG to PNG renderer I used a different renderer from this site [1] and it turned out a bit sharper for the 16x16 image.
(In reply to Wim Jongman from comment #68) > Created attachment 280284 [details] > Different SVG to PNG renderer > > I used a different renderer from this site [1] and it turned out a bit > sharper for the 16x16 image. [1] https://svgtopng.com/
Gerrit change https://git.eclipse.org/r/151184 was merged to [master]. Commit: http://git.eclipse.org/c/platform/eclipse.platform.images.git/commit/?id=59bab45f8bc33fde1bd5acb8117c716ebdb6ca60
Gerrit change https://git.eclipse.org/r/151185 was merged to [master]. Commit: http://git.eclipse.org/c/platform/eclipse.platform.ui.git/commit/?id=9aa6956a909a058c24fd9bc6645437cd83399d45
Created attachment 280385 [details] New menu icon in Quick Search The new icon is quite difficult to spot in light themed Quick Search.
(In reply to Paul Pazderski from comment #72) > Created attachment 280385 [details] > New menu icon in Quick Search > > The new icon is quite difficult to spot in light themed Quick Search. Quick search is doing something special with the icon. Please file a bug for quick search.
(In reply to Wim Jongman from comment #73) > (In reply to Paul Pazderski from comment #72) > > Created attachment 280385 [details] > > New menu icon in Quick Search > > > > The new icon is quite difficult to spot in light themed Quick Search. > > Quick search is doing something special with the icon. Please file a bug for > quick search. Wait, I think it is my issue. The icon must also be copied to workbench images, which Gerrit I mistakenly abandoned.
(In reply to Eclipse Genie from comment #71) > Gerrit change https://git.eclipse.org/r/151185 was merged to [master]. > Commit: > http://git.eclipse.org/c/platform/eclipse.platform.ui.git/commit/ > ?id=9aa6956a909a058c24fd9bc6645437cd83399d45 This change is missing the @2x.png file. Pls. add it.
(In reply to Matthias Becker from comment #75) > (In reply to Eclipse Genie from comment #71) > > Gerrit change https://git.eclipse.org/r/151185 was merged to [master]. > > Commit: > > http://git.eclipse.org/c/platform/eclipse.platform.ui.git/commit/ > > ?id=9aa6956a909a058c24fd9bc6645437cd83399d45 > > This change is missing the @2x.png file. Pls. add it. That was committed earlier.
New Gerrit change created: https://git.eclipse.org/r/151579
New Gerrit change created: https://git.eclipse.org/r/151580
Gerrit change https://git.eclipse.org/r/151579 was merged to [master]. Commit: http://git.eclipse.org/c/platform/eclipse.platform.images.git/commit/?id=24bc46adc09368944adae2d7e8ea90fee54cee0e
Gerrit change https://git.eclipse.org/r/151580 was merged to [master]. Commit: http://git.eclipse.org/c/platform/eclipse.platform.ui.git/commit/?id=4e970b09bb225df0c76205ade8e0e1b3bad1face
Created attachment 280415 [details] Icon in quick search
To me this just seems disruptive. My first first reaction was "what kind of separator is this"? The separators between toolbars on the main toolbar also look like a bunch of vertical dots and this just look like an emphasized version of that. The original premise seemed to be to make it look like a "standard menu hamburger" but we end up instead with vertical ellipses that are different than what's familiar and yet in no way similar to any kind of "standard appearance" for a menu button. The chevron to me was far better, perhaps just because it was familiar, but also because the menu drops below the chevron. More importantly, toolbar buttons with drop-down menus also and still use a chevron, and of course submenus also use a chevron, each of chevrons showing the direction where the menu will appear. Now we have chevrons in the some places but dots in others for controls that in the end, do the same thing: show a menu. Ellipses are generally used to indicate a modal dialog will come up, so why that was chosen is totally not obvious to me. Does anyone think this looks like a hamburger? -100
(In reply to Ed Merks from comment #82) Hey Ed, thanks for your unsalted opinion. It is indeed a big change, but we did it because people do not associate the standalone chevron icon with a menu. > The chevron to me was far better, perhaps > just because it was familiar, You said it there. Please give it some time.
Resetting to the default assignee.
Created attachment 280442 [details] Example of such a new thing right next to a menu toolbar button I'm sure it's safe to say that after 20 years, millions of users do associate the existing icon with the existing function and I'm 100% sure its safe to say that 0% of the users will associate anything with a vertical ... until they click it or hover over it. If it were a hamburger of some sort, one might be able to argue (with no statistical basis) that it would be more familiar to some/many new users and that existing users would find it better... In this screen capture its clear that the narrowness of the image makes the spacing just look strange and awkward, like a separator, and it's clear that the toolbar button with drop down given a complete different idea of what an icon for a drop down menu should look like. But I'll shut up now...
(In reply to Ed Merks from comment #85) > Created attachment 280442 [details] > Example of such a new thing right next to a menu toolbar button > > I'm sure it's safe to say that after 20 years, millions of users do > associate the existing icon with the existing function and I'm 100% sure its > safe to say that 0% of the users will associate anything with a vertical ... > until they click it or hover over it. If it were a hamburger of some sort, > one might be able to argue (with no statistical basis) that it would be more > familiar to some/many new users and that existing users would find it > better... > > In this screen capture its clear that the narrowness of the image makes the > spacing just look strange and awkward, like a separator, and it's clear that > the toolbar button with drop down given a complete different idea of what an > icon for a drop down menu should look like. > > But I'll shut up now... What was the reason for not using a hamburger?
Created attachment 280444 [details] Dots used in Gmail I like this changes, three dots seems a pattern used frequently in web applications like Gmail (screenshot attached).
(In reply to Matthias Becker from comment #86) > > What was the reason for not using a hamburger? Our discussions lead to favoring the look and feel of the vertical ellipsis over the hamburger menu. The problematic restriction we have with all icons is that one icon must work for all themes. A frustrating task which may lead to "settling" with the icon that looks average on all themes. The light [1] and dark [2] hamburgers have both the light and dark themes combined in a 16x16 matrix. Alternatively, because of the restriction, we can use a shade of gray. However, as we can see with the new "Find actions" icon, it remains a trade-off. Since both the hamburger and the vertical ellipsis are *well-known* menu icons we decided to use the ellipsis. Please see the comment history. [1] https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/attachment.cgi?id=280142 [2] https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/attachment.cgi?id=280143
By the way. The vertical ellipsis is called the kebab menu: https://twitter.com/lukew/status/591296890030915585
