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Re: [rt-pmc] Virgo new web admin console and JavaScript support
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We discussed this on the PMC call today. The group on the call (Tom,
Markus, Doug, Jesse, Mike) agreed to allow the approval process to move
forward. From a technical stance we did not feel we had the expertise in
the area to either validate or invalidate your technical claims. In the
end we agreed to trust in the Virgo leadership in picking the best
technical solution for the Virgo project.
Did you consult with other projects at eclipse that are heavy
users/developers of JavaScript? For example, the Orion project?
Tom
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|Glyn Normington <gnormington@xxxxxxxxxx> |
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|Runtime Project PMC mailing list <rt-pmc@xxxxxxxxxxx>, |
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|03/20/2012 05:46 AM |
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|Re: [rt-pmc] Virgo new web admin console and JavaScript support |
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I couldn't go into detail here even if I knew the detail, but I believe the
main issue with MooTools was around provenance of the code and I think
there were similar, but more serious issues with JQuery.
MooTools has a MIT license and JQuery is dual licensed under GPL and MIT
(Eclipse would clearly choose MIT), so these are certainly acceptable
licenses.
As for CQs, MooTools has 5472/5473 and JQuery 20 CQs including 6308 and
6134 for 1.7.1.
But I don't think we should attempts to analyse the IP issues further here
as the experts are in the Eclipse legal team. I am simply seeking a
technical approval, so thanks for your vote of confidence.
Regards,
Glyn
On 20 Mar 2012, at 10:37, Campo, Christian wrote:
Hi Glyn,
I pro everything :-). However you talked a lot about the technical
issues. I am not soo deep in the IP issues, so I'd like to understand
those. What are the licenses for JQuery and for MooTools. What are
the CQs for both of them? Why is the one harder than the other
IP-wise? I think that you are soo deep in the ongoing discussion that
you lost me where the IP-problems are.
Maybe that helps than everyone to start a discussion.
thanks
christian
Von: Glyn Normington <gnormington@xxxxxxxxxx>
Antworten an: Runtime Project PMC mailing list <rt-pmc@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Datum: Tue, 20 Mar 2012 10:36:29 +0100
An: Runtime Project PMC mailing list <rt-pmc@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Betreff: [rt-pmc] Virgo new web admin console and JavaScript support
We have developed a new web admin console for Virgo and are having
difficulty getting the JavaScript library we selected, MooTools,
through the Eclipse IP process. The alternative is to use JQuery
which is being used by some other projects. JQuery also had IP issues
and required Eclipse Board approval in order to be used by Eclipse
projects. I would like the Eclipse Board to approve Virgo's use of
MooTools and I need the RT PMC's support before proceeding further.I
would be grateful for feedback from RT PMC members.
Firstly, I hope it is easy to agree that Virgo needs JavaScript
support in order to provide a modern UI in its web admin console.
JQuery and MooTools are the front-runners in this field. We have
previously used dojo, but this has serious limitations and is proving
unworkable for the improvements we are now introducing.
Secondly, can we agree that Virgo should be allowed to use JQuery as
a fall-back position if MooTools does not make it through the Board?
Please note that if the Board decides that MooTools is unacceptable
we would want to use the latest JQuery 1.7.x which would also require
approval by the Board as the latest version they have already
approved is 1.6.x.
Thirdly and finally, I would like the RT PMC's support to request
Board approval for MooTools 1.4.x (all of it, including "core" and
"more", to be clear). The rationale for Virgo's use of MooTools is as
follows.
Virgo has been prototyping a new web admin console with an improved
architecture such that it can be used to manage non-web Virgo
distributions. The user interface has been radically reworked and
improved.
The current Virgo web admin console uses dojo for its user interface,
which we have found to be pretty inflexible. Also the use of dojo
puts us in quite a risky position as we were only able to obtain IP
approval for a subset of dojo and changes to the console could well
have required us to step into the currently unapproved subset. But
inflexibility is what forced us to look for a better alternative. We
considered MooTools and JQuery, but decided on MooTools as explained
below.
JQuery is probably a significant advance on dojo, but suffers from
some basic inflexibility compared to MooTools. MooTools provides a
lower-level kit of parts which enable high level user interface
widgets, such as trees, to be constructed with precisely the
characteristics required. With JQuery it looks likely to be a lot
harder to customise the supplied high-level constructs to accurately
satisfy our requirements. We certainly found customising the high
level constructs in dojo very difficult. By comparison, customising
MooTools has been very easy.
We understand that the IP risk of JQuery is greater than that of
MooTools, with no obvious technical benefit and a substantial risk of
being unsuitable for the Virgo web admin console's requirements, so
from a Virgo project perspective, MooTools seems better on all
fronts.
Given that both JQuery and MooTools carry some IP risk, having Virgo
use MooTools and other projects use JQuery will reduce the overall IP
risk to Eclipse.org.
To summarise, I would like the RT PMC's thoughts, and (eventually or
right now) support in the form of +1's, for:
1. Virgo's use of JavaScript and therefore JQuery or MooTools.
2. Virgo's use of JQuery 1.7 if MooTools proves to be unacceptable to
the Eclipse Board.
3. Virgo's use of MooTools 1.4.x as the preferred technical solution
subject to approval by the Eclipse Board.
Regards,
Glyn
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