[stp-dev] IRC log

["Trieloff, Carl" <CTRIELOFF@xxxxxxxx>]

[12:04] cctrieloff: topics from the group?
[12:04] DavidBosschaert: Hi Carl. I would like to suggest an agenda item, triggered by a mail from Rob Cernicz:
[12:04] *** RobCernich has joined #eclipseSTP.
[12:04] cctrieloff: go for it
[12:05] DavidBosschaert: Rob sent a mail to STP-Dev regarding the use of Bugzilla. Maybe we should discuss this.
[12:05] askehill: do we need to have a quick chat around build systems?
[12:06] cctrieloff: want do you want to discuss on both topics?
[12:06] cctrieloff: David / Adrian?
[12:07] DavidBosschaert: Regarding Bugzilla...
[12:07] DavidBosschaert: Currently the commit process does not really talk about this.
[12:07] cctrieloff: should it?
[12:07] DavidBosschaert: Rob suggested to include this, Rob, could you elaborate?
[12:08] cctrieloff: Rob?
[12:08] askehill: Rob also put an email out around the use of the PDE vs. the build system I was proposing so I guess I'd like to discuss the merits of using the PDE build and see if we can reach a consensus for how to do it
[12:09] cctrieloff: I am not a fan of only having a PDE build system - I would like something that can be automated and run from PDE
[12:09] DavidBosschaert: It looks like Rob went for a cup of tea :)
[12:09] RobCernich: sorry
[12:10] RobCernich: which would you like to discuss first
[12:10] RobCernich: ok, build system...
[12:11] RobCernich: the PDE contains tasks for generating build.xml
[12:11] RobCernich: this is the same code used by the tooling
[12:11] RobCernich: it can be invoked in an automated build system using Ant
[12:11] askehill: yip, only hassle I ran into with it was it generated a bunch of hard coded paths into the build.xml so it relied on eclipse being present in a very specific location
[12:12] RobCernich: I don't think that's a problem
[12:12] RobCernich: so long as the build files are generated as part of the build
[12:12] RobCernich: i.e. don't check these files into cvs
[12:12] askehill: now this is where I ran into some problems, I wasn't able to get those files automatically generated (eclipse 3.0) without actually launching a full workbench
[12:13] askehill: if we have some means of exporting this (and I must confess to not having used the PDE in a good few months) then it would sound like a good solution, we'd need to make sure though that testing was also covered
[12:13] RobCernich: i can check on the details, but i know for certain they can be run in an automated fashion
[12:14] RobCernich: you may need to do something like eclipse -application ant Application ...
[12:14] RobCernich: i.e. run ant using eclipse
[12:15] RobCernich: i believe this is necessary for parsing the plug-in manifests
[12:16] askehill: ok then, I'll take the PDE for a quick test drive tomorrow to see how it fares out... it maybe that we use the PDE in conjunction with some specific ant scripts to perform additional work for us, such as testing for example
[12:17] RobCernich: please email me if you have any troubles (I'll be out tomorrow, but will be back on fri)
[12:17] askehill: grand job, will do
[12:17] askehill: Naci also dropped me a line so hopefully we can pair up on this over the coming days and get something much more solid in place
[12:18] RobCernich: as for bugzilla, it was really a recommendation
[12:19] RobCernich: the issue with outside contributions, those made by non-committers, is that they need to be licensed under EPL
[12:19] DavidBosschaert: How does bugzilla help us here?
[12:19] cctrieloff: correct - and we need to IP log them
[12:20] RobCernich: this req is satisfied through the usage agreement
[12:20] cctrieloff: Bugzillia records from who and the usage statement
[12:20] cctrieloff: thus bugzilla creates the audit trail
[12:20] RobCernich: right
[12:21] RobCernich: i believe the mailing lists are covered by the same usage agreement
[12:21] RobCernich: not sure about the news groups
[12:21] DavidBosschaert: So how does would you suggest to include this, similar to WTP? I can dig up the WTP bugzilla section...
[12:21] RobCernich: don't quote me on that
[12:21] cctrieloff: I would go ahead and use bugzilla - but I don't know why we need to call is out in the commit process
[12:21] cctrieloff: I think we would add in it a section of bugzilla usage
[12:22] RobCernich: i don't think we need to
[12:22] RobCernich: i was responding to the comments regarding code reviews and contributions made by non-committers
[12:22] cctrieloff: ok  - got it
[12:22] RobCernich: specified in the document
[12:22] DavidBosschaert: Allright, so lets modify that section accordingly with a reference to bugzilla usage...
[12:23] cctrieloff: yes should call out that non-committer contributions need to be logged into bugzilla
[12:23] cctrieloff: good - it is in cvs - anyone can go make that edit
[12:23] DavidBosschaert: Will do.
[12:23] cctrieloff: thanks
[12:23] DavidBosschaert: Were we not also going to write up a contribution process?
[12:24] DavidBosschaert: For lumps of code so to speak?
[12:24] cctrieloff: yes Karl was going to do that
[12:24] DavidBosschaert: It would make sense in there too.
[12:24] cctrieloff: he is not on this week -
[12:24] cctrieloff: yes Rob do you want to call that out for Karl when he creates it
[12:25] RobCernich: call what out?
[12:25] RobCernich: (sorry)
[12:25] cctrieloff: to make sure we call out the bugzilla use for  non-committers
[12:26] cctrieloff: any more topics for today?
[12:26] RobCernich: sure
[12:28] cctrieloff: Oisin had asked if we could keep the IRC open all the time
[12:28] cctrieloff: as they start getting code in for direct interactions
[12:29] DavidBosschaert: Isn't it open anyway?
[12:29] cctrieloff: My suggestion is if anyone wants to use IRC for an issue - just mail the dev list - open the channel and then post the result back to the list
[12:29] cctrieloff: the first person to log in "opens" the channel. the name #eclipseSTP has been reserved
[12:30] askehill: are we sticking with the 5PM Wednesday slot?
[12:30] cctrieloff: Yes I would like to
[12:31] askehill: ok
[12:31] cctrieloff: I think what Oisin was thinking was if he was working on the build system to open an IRC with you and Naci to coordinate etc
[12:31] askehill: yeah that would be perfect
[12:32] cctrieloff: so I think use the IRC as much as desired, just post notice (even if it is 5/10 minutes) and result to the list
[12:32] cctrieloff: sound good?
[12:32] DavidBosschaert: Just as an FYI...
[12:33] DavidBosschaert: My IRC client (Trillian) simply automatically logs in when I boot up my machine.
[12:33] DavidBosschaert: Quite handy because you simply see what happens without having to do anything.
[12:34] cctrieloff: yip, that is useful - I think Adi and a few others are up all the time from what I can see
[12:34] cctrieloff: any more topics for today
[12:35] *** moghrabi has joined #eclipseSTP.
[12:36] cctrieloff: I think we are done - I will post it to the list