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Re: [platform-help-dev] why does the help window have two toolbars?
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Erik,
The SWT toolbar is gone now (next F2 build should have the changes) and the
back/forward icons moved to the content toolbar area as suggested. We
needed to remove the SWT toolbar to avoid keyboard navigation problems
caused by the embedding of IE inside SWT, and your comments helped us
realize there wasn't much to lose by doing so.
-dorian
Erik
Hennum/Oakland/IBM@IBMUS To: platform-help-dev@xxxxxxxxxxx
Sent by: cc:
platform-help-dev-admin@e Subject: Re: [platform-help-dev] why does the help window have two toolbars?
clipse.org
05/17/2002 08:25 PM
Please respond to
platform-help-dev
Hi, Konrad:
Thanks for the explanation. Not to whinge, but...
1. I thought Netscape 4 had some startup mechanism to open the browser in
"kiosk mode" without the menu bar or toolbars. Did they remove that from
Netscape 6?
Even if Netscape opens with toolbars, I would think that it's more usable
to duplicate functionality than to split functionality between the
containing window's toolbar and the contained HTML toolbar. To get to the
SWT toolbar, the mouse has to move much farther from the content links.
Also, the user can't look in one place for the content operations.
By the same reasoning, shouldn't the print button be in the SWT toolbar and
off the HTML toolbar?
2. Regarding a link replacing the frameset, won't links open in the main
content frame by default? If the content developer needs to open a link in
a full window, couldn't he or she target the link to a _blank window?
In the rare cases where the linked resource reopens itself in the top
window or where the documentation plugin contains legacy HTML that targets
in the top window, couldn't the user open the right-mouse context menu to
go back? Or, if the user doesn't know about the right-mouse menu, couldn't
the user always close and reopen the help?
What if a topic links to a resource that redirects to another URL? The
back button will merely repeats the redirect. To get past the redirect,
the user would need a back menu. Because Eclipse doesn't provide a back
menu, the workaround will still be to close and reopen the help. Why is
the workaround more acceptable for this case than for the top window case?
My concern is that the SWT frame toolbar seems to make the UI worse in 99%
of the cases without really doing away with a workaround.
For what it's worth,
Erik Hennum
ehennum@xxxxxxxxxx
Konrad
Kolosowski/Toronto/IBM@I To:
platform-help-dev@xxxxxxxxxxx
BMCA cc:
platform-help-dev@xxxxxxxxxxx, platform-help-dev-admin@xxxxxxxxxxx
Sent by: Subject: Re:
[platform-help-dev] why does the help window have two toolbars?
platform-help-dev-admin@
eclipse.org
05/17/2002 01:10 PM
Please respond to
platform-help-dev
It is easy to implement back and forward buttons in HTML, but we decided
not to have them for the following reasons:
On non-Windows platform we do not have an embedded browser, and help is
viewed in Mozilla or Netscape browsers that have a back and forward buttons
of their own. Having these buttons also inside HTML area would not make
sense.
On Windows, it is possible for a document to have a link that will result
in the whole frameset being replaced with other contents. At this point
there would be no way to restore help HTML frameset as the buttons would be
wiped out from the view, if they were inside the HTML view. Having buttons
on the SWT frame is a must.
Konrad Kolosowski
Eclipse Help System
Erik
Hennum/Oakland/IBM@IBMUS To:
platform-help-dev@xxxxxxxxxxx
Sent by: cc:
platform-help-dev-admin@e Subject:
[platform-help-dev] why does the help window have two
clipse.org toolbars?
05/17/2002 03:46 PM
Please respond to
platform-help-dev
Hi, Ecliptans:
Probably this issue has come up before, but I couldn't find it in the mail
archives or a search of the newsgroup.
Why does the help viewer window in framework Eclipse help (and I presume,
standalone Eclipse help) have the toolbar with forward / back in the
containing window as well as a DHTML toolbar in the window contents?
I would have expected that forward / back could be implemented pretty
easily with JavaScript in the DHTML toolbar. There would be also be
significant benefits to adding to the display space by eliminating the
window's toolbar and in offering a single mechanism to modify the help UI.
Was there a reason it wasn't possible to implement forward / back in the
window content toolbar?
Thanks in advance,
Erik Hennum
ehennum@xxxxxxxxxx
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