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RE: [cdt-dev] FW: CDT/embedded sessions at EclipseCon
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Hi Sebastien, Sumit,
From our point of view we would like to keep "Embedded" as the key areas
to focus the BoF discussion as this was our intention when we proposed
the BoF.
There is definite intersection between Embedded development and Remote
development in general in the sense that the embedded devices are
remote, attached to the host, or perhaps available on the network -
however remote debugging is only a subset of the issues that any
embedded tool vendor will face when trying to build a deeply embedded
aware debuggers based on Eclipse Debug or CDT. We'd like to highlight
the other aspects as well.
Remote development in my mind is a separate discussion point since it
encompasses a whole world of self contained scenarios that may or may
not include debugging in the embedded space.
A meeting next week to clarify the topics could be good. I'm open to
it.
Regards,
Martin
--
----
Martin Imrisek <mimrisek@xxxxxx>
Software Systems Designer
Software Development Systems
Texas Instruments
416-340-2096
-----Original Message-----
From: cdt-dev-admin@xxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:cdt-dev-admin@xxxxxxxxxxx] On
Behalf Of Sebastien Marineau
Sent: January 24, 2005 11:42 AM
To: cdt-dev@xxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: [cdt-dev] FW: CDT/embedded sessions at EclipseCon
Hi Sumit,
Your suggestions are fine by me. TI, Montavista, others -- any comments?
As for setting up a call -- I can do that. I'm assuming we want to have
the others participate as well, so what time would work best for
everyone?
Thanks,
Sebastien
> -----Original Message-----
> From: cdt-dev-admin@xxxxxxxxxxx
> [mailto:cdt-dev-admin@xxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Sumit Sarkar
> Sent: Friday, January 21, 2005 5:42 PM
> To: cdt-dev@xxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: Re: [cdt-dev] FW: CDT/embedded sessions at EclipseCon
>
> Hi Sebastien,
>
> Instead of "Embedded Development and Debugging", we like to call it
> "CDT Remote Development and Debugging" - the 1st March BOF. Can we
> come up with a "BOF theme" - so that the participants get a "platform"
> to discuss about? Like what are the challenges a developer face when
> they try to develop on a Remote machine and then what are the
> solutions are being currently worked on.
>
> Can we setup a meeting (may be next week) to discuss further on this
> BOF?
>
> Thanks,
> sumit
>
>
>
>
> On Fri, 21 Jan 2005 15:05:14 -0500, Sebastien Marineau
> <sebastien@xxxxxxx> wrote:
> > Good catch -- that is indeed Tuesday the 28th :-)
> >
> > So here's where we are at for the BOFs:
> >
> > Eclipse CDT BOF
> > Intel (20 min) - Leo Treggiari - Managed Build System
> overview Altera
> > (10-20 mins?) - Tracy Miranda - What Altera has been doing,
> > discussion on CDT features IBM (20 mins) - John Camelon -
> the latest
> > in cool parsing, and demo of the DOM viewer IBM (20 mins) - Doug -
> > Demo of IBM C++/UML visualizer (built on CDT) QNX (15 mins) - Dave
> > Inglis - Debug discussion
> >
> > Embedded development and debugging
> > TI (20 mins) -- Chris Recoskie - demo, remote debugging issues
> > Montavista (20 mins) - Pierre-Alexandre Masse - current status on
> > remote debug, ideas for the future HP -- Sumit Sarkar - Remote
> > development?
> >
> > In terms of other participation, how about WindRiver,
> Timesys, Redhat,
> > Rockwell, others?
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > Sebastien
> >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: cdt-dev-admin@xxxxxxxxxxx
> > > [mailto:cdt-dev-admin@xxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Pierre-Alexandre
> > > Masse
> > > Sent: Thursday, January 20, 2005 3:44 PM
> > > To: cdt-dev@xxxxxxxxxxx
> > > Subject: Re: [cdt-dev] FW: CDT/embedded sessions at EclipseCon
> > >
> > > Do you mean it will be a week without Tuesday then?
> > > Just kidding ;)
> > >
> > > Pierre-Alexandre
> > >
> > > Recoskie, Chris wrote:
> > >
> > > > 2005 isn't a leap year so doing a BOF on the 29^th may
> > > prove difficult
> > > > without a flux capacitor
> > > >
> > > > ___________________________________________
> > > >
> > > > Chris Recoskie
> > > >
> > > > Software Designer
> > > >
> > > > IDE Frameworks Group
> > > >
> > > > Texas Instruments, Toronto
> > > >
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > *From:* cdt-dev-admin@xxxxxxxxxxx
> > > > [mailto:cdt-dev-admin@xxxxxxxxxxx]
> > > > *On Behalf Of *Sebastien Marineau
> > > > *Sent:* Wednesday, January 19, 2005 5:14 PM
> > > > *To:* cdt-dev@xxxxxxxxxxx
> > > > *Subject:* [cdt-dev] FW: CDT/embedded sessions at EclipseCon
> > > >
> > > > Hi folks,
> > > >
> > > > Concerning the BOFs, I did get information back from the
> > > > EclipseCon organizers -- please see the email from
> Bjorn further
> > > > below. The bottom line is that we have the freedom to
> organize our
> > > > own
> > > BOFs, as
> > > > well as set the schedule.
> > > >
> > > > To get the ball rolling, our original proposal was to hold
> > > 2 BOFs, as
> > > > listed below.
> > > >
> > > > Eclipse CDT BOF:
> > > >
> > > > Meet the experts and discuss the implementation and
> > > direction of CDT.
> > > > The format will likely be a series of mini-overviews on
> different
> > > > aspects of CDT along with open discussions.Intel, IBM, QNX
> > > and Redhat
> > > > have volunteered to present here. We will also try to get a few
> > > > customers to present their experiences.
> > > >
> > > > Remote development and debugging BOF:
> > > >
> > > > TI, HP, Montavista and IBM have expressed strong interest
> > > in hosting
> > > > this. The main focus would be on the specific
> challenges of using
> > > > Eclipse and CDT in a host/target configuration, both for
> > > development
> > > > and debugging. This spans the range from deeply
> embedded (TI) to
> > > > traditional embedded (Mvista) to the server/mini types of
> > > apps (HP and
> > > > IBM). I also expect we can get a couple of customers to
> > > participate in
> > > > this as well.
> > > >
> > > > My suggestion is to schedule these for the Tuesday and
> > > Wednesday - the
> > > > general CDT BOF on Tuesday the 29th, and the remote
> > > > development/debugging BOF on Wednesday (March 1st).
> > > >
> > > > As for the content, I do know that additional companies (e.g.
> > > > Windriver) have expressed interest in participating, so
> > > maybe we can
> > > > start by having everyone throw out what they'd like to
> contribute
> > > > (discussion topics, mini-presentations, demos etc) and
> > > we'll collect
> > > > it into the BOF "program".
> > > >
> > > > Cheers,
> > > >
> > > > Sebastien
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > --
> > > > --
> > > >
> > > > *From:* Bjorn Freeman-Benson [mailto:bjorn@xxxxxxxxxxxx]
> > > > *Sent:* Wednesday, January 19, 2005 4:21 PM
> > > > *To:* 'Dwight Deugo'; sebastien@xxxxxxx
> > > > *Subject:* RE: CDT/embedded sessions at EclipseCon
> > > >
> > > > Sebastien,
> > > >
> > > > Please forward this clarification to the CDT mailing
> > > list - thank you.
> > > >
> > > > I, as the EclipseCon Organizing Chair / Final
> Arbitrar of All
> > > > Things EclipseCon, received a forwarded copy of
> this CDT mailing
> > > > list and I'd like to take the opportunity to set the record
> > > > straight / clarify the situation...
> > > >
> > > > Hello All,
> > > >
> > > > While working out some issues with my registration
> > > I just got
> > > > word from Meeting Strategies Worldwide (they're
> doing the
> > > > registration etc for EclipseCon) that the
> decision on which
> > > > BOFs to go with will be made onsite. Yes, you read
> > > that right
> > > > - onsite on the day of.
> > > >
> > > > This means that if we want to do a BOF we will have
> > > to submit
> > > > our proposals yet again.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Relevant text quoted:
> > > >
> > > > **_I have just received word today that all BoF
> submissions
> > > > have been neither accepted nor rejected - all BoFs
> > > will now be
> > > > decided upon onsite at the conference. An email
> will be sent
> > > > very soon, to all people who have submitted BoFs
> > > detailing the
> > > > process for getting their BoF submitted onsite._**
> > > >
> > > > It might be worthwhile to not rely on the EclipseCon
> > > > organizers for this and organize a BOF ourselves -
> > > does anyone
> > > > from the Bay area got some meeting space they
> could donate?
> > > > ;^)
> > > >
> > > > We (and by this I mean the Singular We, i.e., me) decided to
> > > > organize the BOFs at EclipseCon 2005 exactly the
> same way they
> > > > were run at EclipseCon 2004. We made this choice
> because it is
> > > > organizationally much simpler. Here's how it worked
> > > last year and
> > > > here's how it's going to work this year:
> > > >
> > > > * One goal for BOFs is to facilitate the informal
> > > gathering of
> > > > similarly interested attendees.
> > > >
> > > > * Another goal for BOFs is to make the process
> of gathering
> > > > for a BOF as simple as possible for everyone involved.
> > > >
> > > > * Another goal is to make best use of the
> meeting space we
> > > > have available. Thus we want to provide the
> > > larger rooms to
> > > > the BOFs with more people and the smaller
> rooms to those
> > > > with fewer people.
> > > >
> > > > * An explicit negative goal for BOFs is to prevent
> > > their being
> > > > hijacked by companies using them as
> advertising pitches.
> > > > Allowing BOFs to be pre-scheduled has, at other
> > > conferences,
> > > > allowed them to be taken over by marketing types.
> > > >
> > > > So, here's the process - it's very simple and I think
> > > you'll find
> > > > that it easily meets your needs as well our overall goals:
> > > >
> > > > 1. At EclipseCon there is a bulletin board. Beside
> > > the bulletin
> > > > board are blank sign-up sheets.
> > > >
> > > > 2. You arrive at the conference, you go to the
> > > bulletin board,
> > > > you take a sign-up sheet and write "CDT" in
> the title box.
> > > > You thumb tack it on the bulletin board.
> > > >
> > > > 3. During the day, interested people sign up on
> the sheets on
> > > > the board for the BOFs they are interested in.
> > > >
> > > > 4. At 5pm, the organizers (that's me or one of the other
> > > > volunteers) looks at the attendance of each
> of the BOFs on
> > > > the board and assigns them to rooms by writing, in big
> > > > letters, the room name (e.g., Seaside B) on the page.
> > > >
> > > > 5. After enjoying the free food at the reception
> > > that evening,
> > > > people wander by the bulletin board to learn
> which room
> > > > their BOF is assigned to.
> > > >
> > > > This process meets the goals:
> > > >
> > > > * People can decided to meet in a BOF in
> advance or at the
> > > > last minute. If you want to schedule it in
> advance, simple
> > > > agree amongst all your colleagues that you are
> > > going to have
> > > > a BOF on, say, Tuesday night. Put up a sign-up sheet,
> > > > sign-up, and get assigned a room. The BOF I'm
> involved in
> > > > (Language Toolkits and Universal IDEs) is doing
> > > exactly that
> > > > - see the announcement that Chris Laffra posted to the
> > > > eclipse.eclipsecon newsgroup.
> > > >
> > > > * Simple physical sheets of paper are easy. Without
> > > having to
> > > > write any complex programs, they allow us to
> > > easily allocate
> > > > rooms by size and they are easy for the people
> > > attending the
> > > > conference to sign up on and to read.
> > > >
> > > > * Allocating rooms at 5pm the day-of allows us
> to make the
> > > > best use of space. There are plenty of rooms,
> but some of
> > > > them are very small and I'd hate to have to
> pre-guess the
> > > > size of each BOF. I know I don't know whether CDT
> > > or WTP is
> > > > going to draw a larger crowd. This way we will know.
> > > >
> > > > * Not pre-scheduling BOFs prevents vendors from
> > > using them as
> > > > advertising rooms because they can't say "come by
> > > room X at
> > > > time Y to hear us talk about product Z". It
> allows you and
> > > > your colleagues to do so, because you are collectively
> > > > agreeing to meet, but it prevents sales
> pitches because in
> > > > those cases there is no collective agreement - it's a
> > > > one-way communication.
> > > >
> > > > So, by all means, please schedule a CDT BOF. I look
> forward to
> > > > your having a really great time at the conference, and
> > > I apologize
> > > > if this mechanism was not explained to you before.
> Mea culpa...
> > > >
> > > > Regards,
> > > >
> > > > Bjorn Freeman-Benson
> > > >
> > > > EclipseCon Organizing Chair
> > > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > cdt-dev mailing list
> > > cdt-dev@xxxxxxxxxxx
> > > http://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/listinfo/cdt-dev
> > >
> > _______________________________________________
> > cdt-dev mailing list
> > cdt-dev@xxxxxxxxxxx
> > http://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/listinfo/cdt-dev
> >
> _______________________________________________
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> http://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/listinfo/cdt-dev
>
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