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Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] 1000 line limit for contributions

Janet / Mike - can we make that happen ?

Or at least get the bug updated with what is standing in the way for Denis to attack this as the beast he say he is ?

/max
http://about.me/maxandersen


> On 20 Nov 2015, at 19:58, Denis Roy <denis.roy@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> 
>> On 11/20/2015 01:54 PM, Max Rydahl Andersen wrote:
>> https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=382798
>> 
>> I believe that is the bug and what I was told on every board meeting since I joined was that it's just waiting on automation.
> 
> The bug is opened against EMO (Community > Process).  Legal would need
> to assign that bug to webmaster@xxxxxxxxxxx and instruct us to do something.
> 
> Not that I don't trust you ....  :)
> 
> D.
> 
> 
> 
>> 
>> Denis - I'll sit back and applaud your magic :)
>> 
>> /max
>> http://about.me/maxandersen
>> 
>> 
>>>> On 20 Nov 2015, at 19:45, Denis Roy <denis.roy@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> On 11/20/2015 01:42 PM, Max Rydahl Andersen wrote:
>>>> Denis, what's the holdup ? :)
>>> 
>>> There's no bug? With Legal's sign-off?
>>> 
>>> "Have fingers, will code."
>>> 
>>> D.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> /max
>>>> http://about.me/maxandersen
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> On 20 Nov 2015, at 19:36, John Arthorne <John_Arthorne@xxxxxxxxxx
>>>> <mailto:John_Arthorne@xxxxxxxxxx>> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> The "allow committers to contribute to other eclipse projects" topic
>>>>> is well underway in the Eclipse Board. There is a problem that some
>>>>> committers have written agreements from their employer that only
>>>>> allows them to participate on a particular project. The Foundation
>>>>> needs to put some automation in place to handle this, but there is a
>>>>> path forward here and progress is being made.
>>>>> 
>>>>> John
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> -----cross-project-issues-dev-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>> <mailto:-----cross-project-issues-dev-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: -----
>>>>> To: Cross project issues <cross-project-issues-dev@xxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>> <mailto:cross-project-issues-dev@xxxxxxxxxxx>>
>>>>> From: Lars Vogel
>>>>> Sent by: cross-project-issues-dev-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>> <mailto:cross-project-issues-dev-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>>> Date: 11/20/2015 11:44AM
>>>>> Subject: Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] 1000 line limit for contributions
>>>>> 
>>>>> Great proposal from Max to skip CQ for Eclipse committers. It does not
>>>>> make sense that I can commit 100 000 lines to PDE but not 1001 to
>>>>> another project I'm not a committer for.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Max, can you bring your proposal to the board?
>>>>> 
>>>>> Best regards, Lars
>>>>> 
>>>>> Am 20.11.2015 9:00 vorm. schrieb "Max Rydahl Andersen"
>>>>> <manderse@xxxxxxxxxx <mailto:manderse@xxxxxxxxxx>>:
>>>>> 
>>>>>   On 19 Nov 2015, at 11:17, Ed Merks wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>>       Recall that this was increased from 250 to 1000 not so long
>>>>>       ago.  I wasn't able to push the IP committee beyond that. 
>>>>>       People working for an organization that has a corporate
>>>>>       representative on the board could ask that representative to
>>>>>       raise this issue at a board meeting.  I think that would carry
>>>>>       more weight than me personally asking for a further increase.
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>>   In this case it looks like a broken notification - good it was
>>>>>   found and identified.
>>>>> 
>>>>>   I can personally vouch that the 1000 line limit have directly
>>>>>   taken part in why I have stopped contributing to i.e. mylyndoc
>>>>>   asciidoc support. Here I spent several weekends and eventually
>>>>>   months on getting basic contributions in that was *obviously* not
>>>>>   in any danger of having IP conflicts since the code was copied
>>>>>   from mylyn.doc itself and 100% written by me - still I had to play
>>>>>   the game of splitting up contributions and in the end just stop
>>>>>   doing it. (mylyn.doc could fix this by making me a committer or
>>>>>   eclipse foundation allow contributions from other eclipse
>>>>>   committers without CQ review - but that is just examples of more
>>>>>   process dancing)
>>>>> 
>>>>>   Thus this really is an issue and something I raised to IP and
>>>>>   Legal team several time in the pass - issue is that from their
>>>>>   perspective they don't get to see the times a committer is asked
>>>>>   to split a contribution up; they just see the +1000 lines ones and
>>>>>   think they are fast to get it though the system.
>>>>> 
>>>>>   But If I have to wait 2 weeks between contributions for things
>>>>>   that are not on my critical path I just cannot afford spending
>>>>>   time on it - especially if I have interest in building on top of
>>>>>   these contributions.
>>>>>   And I'm actually a believer in doing things right at eclipse - but
>>>>>   I can just imagine those coming from the outside just never show
>>>>>   up or just leave immediately.
>>>>> 
>>>>>   But to the point on raising this to the IP committee and the board.
>>>>> 
>>>>>   If you get caught in similar dead or live-locks in the IP system
>>>>>   or see another attempt on having to split up otherwise perfect
>>>>>   valid contributions, please consider forwarding me info personally
>>>>>   (manderse@xxxxxxxxxx <mailto:manderse@xxxxxxxxxx>).
>>>>> 
>>>>>   I would like to be able to show to IP committee and board how
>>>>>   often this is actually hurting us - or on the flip side, be
>>>>>   convinced that is not actually that big an issue.
>>>>> 
>>>>>   Thanks,
>>>>>   /max
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>>       On 19/11/2015 11:00 AM, Ed Willink wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>>           Hi
>>>>> 
>>>>>           Presumably you put tests in a separate plugin, so
>>>>>           splitting off the tests as a separate contribution gets
>>>>>           you twice the limit with minimal effort.
>>>>> 
>>>>>           Perhaps a 10000 line limit might be appropriate for
>>>>>           non-deliverable code such as tests and build tools.
>>>>> 
>>>>>           Regards
>>>>> 
>>>>>            Ed Willink
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>>           On 19/11/2015 09:49, Sievers, Jan wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>>               Hi,
>>>>> 
>>>>>               in the course of
>>>>> 
>>>>>               https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=477328
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>>               we had a contribution that slightly exceeded 1000
>>>>>               lines and thus needed a CQ.
>>>>>               It took about one month to review it.
>>>>> 
>>>>>               I am sure the legal team does its very best to keep up
>>>>>               with the load, so the following is in no way a
>>>>>               criticism of the
>>>>>               people who actually do the legal review.
>>>>> 
>>>>>               Rather take it as food for thought to whoever set up
>>>>>               this rule.
>>>>> 
>>>>>               IMHO the 1000 line rule is effectively setting the
>>>>>               wrong incentives for a thriving opensource project.
>>>>> 
>>>>>               Here is why I think so:
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>>               The most diligent contributors add a lot of tests to
>>>>>               their patch to prove it works.
>>>>>               This is a good thing and we actively encourage
>>>>>               contributors to thoroughly test.
>>>>>               Test code can easily outweigh productive code being
>>>>>               tested in terms of LOC.
>>>>>               However this means the most diligent contributors,
>>>>>               i.e. the ones you want to attract, are more likely to
>>>>>               hit the 1000 line limit.
>>>>>               Instead of thanking them for their hard work, we
>>>>>               effectively punish them with an extra month or more
>>>>>               wait time before their patch can be merged.
>>>>>               Apart from that, the 1000 line limit seems arbitrary
>>>>>               to me because technically you can split up any commit
>>>>>               into any number
>>>>>               of smaller commits below the 1000 line limit.
>>>>> 
>>>>>               Best Regards,
>>>>>               Jan
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
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>>>>> 
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>>>>> 
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>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>>   /max
>>>>>   http://about.me/maxandersen
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