[news.eclipse.technology] Re: Eclipse just seems wrong

[Scott Stanchfield <scott@xxxxxxxxxxxx>]

Hi Gregg -- no GridBagLayout debate in this please ;)

In article <bjt9g8$gof$2@xxxxxxxxxxx>, gergg@xxxxxxx says...
> 
> So why can't it just compile my files correctly?  It seems like getting that
> part right would be easy for the developers.  But, I fear that the eclipse
> developers just don't understand how fundamental staying out of the way of
> simple operations is to good GUI design.
> [...]

Eclipse does compile files *correctly* as follows:
1) "Auto build" -- If you want Eclipse to automatically build, you need 
to follow the way it lays out projects. They set this up to use the 
fairly common practice of matching the source file directories to the 
package names. While this isn't necessary when using javac -d, it really 
is the way most folks have structured their source layouts.

Those folks aren't "lemmings", as it's a common structure that that 
actually works. If it didn't work (or was significantly more trouble to 
make work), then "lemmings" might be appropriate. In fact, this 
structure allows you to reuse class names (if appropriate/necessary). 
(While I personally try to avoid reusing class names, there are some 
cases where it may be more meaningful to use the same name in two 
different packages.)

I don't know how your project is structured, but one should be able to 
write a simple script or java proggie that moves classes into the common 
package structure by scanning for a package statement and moving the 
file. I'd suggest walking through the "Getting Started" guide to get a 
feel for eclipse and see if it might be useful to you before putting in 
any effort for this, though.


2) "Ant build" -- you can turn off auto build and use an ant script to 
compile, inside of which you can place any commands you like.
Granted, ant is a bit more work than just entering a command line.


Eclipse is a highly-structured IDE. It is not simply an editor with 
user-defined commands on menus (as kawa is).

This structuring allows some very interesting auto build possibilities, 
as build-tool writers can make certain assumptions about how things are 
laid out. By making assumptions, the end users don't have to do as much 
configuring in command-lines or property sheets; they simply lay out the 
code in a common manner.


This is also one of the features that allows Eclipse to do much more 
than kawa ever could, including when it comes to searching and indexing. 
You mention javadocs creating an index. Eclipse has even better 
navigational support -- try 

  control-shift-t   (or the "Open Type" button on the toolbar)

There you can just enter a class name w/o the package name, making it 
easy to find any class. From there, you can navigate between source 
using hyperlinks, search for refs/impls/decls, etc.


Bottom line -- if you don't like Eclipse, don't use it. Hopefully no one 
is forcing you. Plenty of folks find it very productive, but not 
everyone.

Later,
-- Scott

BTW: I still think BarfBagLayout sucks ;)

==============================================================
Scott Stanchfield    scott@xxxxxxxxxxxx    http://javadude.com

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Lead author of "Effective VisualAge for Java, Version 3"
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