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RE: [tools-pmc] VE incubator - FOCUS
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Doug,
If you think you're frustrated after just one day, just imagine my
frustration having spent several months trying to get the rules changed at
the board level. As you can imagine, the rules for IP cleanliness are
considered sacred; I do agree that they are one of the distinguishing
features of Eclipse that makes it so valuable to commercial consumers.
Based on this experience, I can imagine that an incubating component in
"mature" project is just not going to be acceptable without the actual rule
changes the committer reps (not just me) have been advocating. I'd love to
be wrong, but if I am, I have to wonder why trying to change the rules has
proven so difficult.
Note that at the time EMFT was created, the problem was actually a
different one; there was no parallel IP process back them. The problem
was that projects had no substructure, so I could not partition the
committers into the separate components over which they had control. I
wasn't comfortable just adding people to EMF; like Mik says, I wanted to
set a high bar. But now we have components and I'm pretty happy with the
structure. I was planning on eliminating EMFT (which was in Technology
while EMF was in Tools) when the Modeling PCM was formed, until the
parallel IP process was introduced and was defined to apply only to
conforming incubating projects. So I've had to keep EMFT alive. I'd be
just as happy without it...
I hope nothing I've done is interpreted as anything other than an attempt
to help Philippe build a diverse and vibrant community...
Ed Merks/Toronto/IBM@IBMCA
mailto: merks@xxxxxxxxxx
905-413-3265 (t/l 969)
Doug Schaefer
<DSchaefer@xxxxxx
m> To
Sent by: Tools PMC mailing list
tools-pmc-bounces <tools-pmc@xxxxxxxxxxx>
@eclipse.org cc
Subject
10/22/2007 04:27 RE: [tools-pmc] VE incubator -
PM FOCUS
Please respond to
Tools PMC mailing
list
<tools-pmc@eclips
e.org>
At this point, I give up...
Ed, if you're happy for the rules to be different, why didn't you try to
change them when EMFT was created? That's all I'm trying to do here.
Doug Schaefer, QNX Software Systems
Eclipse CDT Project Lead, http://cdtdoug.blogspot.com
> -----Original Message-----
> From: tools-pmc-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:tools-pmc-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx]
> On Behalf Of Ed Merks
> Sent: Monday, October 22, 2007 4:16 PM
> To: Tools PMC mailing list
> Cc: Tools PMC mailing list; tools-pmc-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: Re: [tools-pmc] VE incubator - FOCUS
>
> John,
>
> Bjorn has talked about bending the rules, but as far as I understand the
> rules and how they've applied to every other project so far (and EMF/EMFT
> in particular), a component can only take advantage of parallel IP if it
> is
> in a conforming incubating project. A conforming incubating project has
> all downloads clearly marked as incubating and displays the little
> incubating egg on its pages. I think only options 3 and 4 fall within
the
> rules as they have been interpreted and enforced to date. It's be happy
> for the rules to be different, but that's why I have an EMFT project and
> that's why the Platform and WTP created incubating projects...
>
>
> Ed Merks/Toronto/IBM@IBMCA
> mailto: merks@xxxxxxxxxx
> 905-413-3265 (t/l 969)
>
>
>
>
>
> John
> Duimovich/Ottawa/
> IBM@IBMCA
To
> Sent by: pombredanne@xxxxxxxxx, Tools PMC
> tools-pmc-bounces mailing list
> @eclipse.org <tools-pmc@xxxxxxxxxxx>
>
cc
> "'Tools PMC mailing list'"
> 10/22/2007 04:02 <tools-pmc@xxxxxxxxxxx>,
> PM tools-pmc-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx
>
Subject
> Re: [tools-pmc] VE incubator -
> Please respond to FOCUS
> Tools PMC mailing
> list
> <tools-pmc@eclips
> e.org>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Philippe
>
> Thanks for persevering.
>
> My vote is +1 on #1 below ... I clarified which project the component
> would
> be a member of below to make it clear it was a component of VE.
>
> -1/ an incubating component within VE (a novel approach) would be
> preferred.
>
> I will consult with the EMO if this is allowed within the current
> incubator
> framework
>
> John
>
>
>
> "Philippe Ombredanne"
> <pombredanne@xxxxxxxxx>
> Sent by:
To
> tools-pmc-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx "'Tools PMC mailing
> list'"
> <tools-pmc@xxxxxxxxxxx>
> 10/22/2007 02:05 PM
cc
>
>
Subject
> Please respond to [tools-pmc] VE incubator
> pombredanne@xxxxxxxxx; Please - FOCUS
> respond to
> Tools PMC mailing list
> <tools-pmc@xxxxxxxxxxx>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> All:
> At that stage I would appreciate that we keep focused on my initial
> request.
> So I am start a new thread.
> I begin to be utterly confused but not yet hopelessly. VE is an all
> volunteer project, so have some mercy.
>
> The only thing we need (for VE at least) is some flexibility:
> VE Committers have expressed their whish to keep the current core code
> base
> and project as is, not move back to incubation. I shall respect that.
>
> We have new contributions comming from serious, law-abiding individuals
> and
> organizations, and I want to keep up our fledgling momentum.
>
> I can do it several ways:
> -1/ an incubating component (a novel approach) would be preferred.
> -2/ an incubating project under VE.
> -3/ a tools incubator
> -4/ a complete separate project.
>
> I am not asking asking for a discussion, but a simple answer on 1, 2, 3
or
> 4
> so I can move on.
>
> Cordially
> --
> Cheers
> Philippe
>
>
> --
> Cheers
> Philippe
>
> philippe ombredanne | 1 650 799 0949 | pombredanne at nexb.com
> nexB - Open by Design (tm) - http://www.nexb.com
> http://easyeclipse.org - http://phpeclipse.net - http://eclipse.org/atf -
> http://eclipse.org/vep - http://labs.jboss.org/drools/ -
> http://developer.mozilla.org/en/docs/XULRunner
>
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