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RE: [platform-update-dev] Investigating some alternative updatemanager

Dejan Glozic wrote on Thursday, September 14, 2006 11:21 PM
>Typically, views are used as auxiliary 
> artifacts that assist
> you with the main task. Updates are occasional activity that 
> do not fit
> into this category (although in the early days of Eclipse we would put
> everything into perspectives and views, hence the 'Help' perspective,
> 'Update' perspective etc.). Thank god those days are gone :-).
Good point. I remember the days of the update perspective with fondness
>:)
Though, I am always annoyed with modla dialogs.
I guess that still a modal dialog to start would be a good way. *sigh*
Thanks!

-- 
Cheers
Philippe

philippe ombredanne | 1 650 799 0949 | pombredanne at nexb.com 
nexB - Open by Design (tm) - http://www.nexb.com 
http://easyeclipse.org  -  irc://irc.freenode.net/easyeclipse



> -----Original Message-----
> From: platform-update-dev-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx 
> [mailto:platform-update-dev-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of 
> Dejan Glozic
> Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2006 11:21 PM
> To: Eclipse Platform Update component developers list.
> Cc: 'Eclipse Platform Update component developers list.'; 
> platform-update-dev-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: RE: [platform-update-dev] Investigating some 
> alternative updatemanager
> 
> 
> I would respectfully suggest checking the UI Guidelines on 
> various Eclipse
> UI artifacts. 
>Typically, views are used as auxiliary 
> artifacts that assist
> you with the main task. Updates are occasional activity that 
> do not fit
> into this category (although in the early days of Eclipse we would put
> everything into perspectives and views, hence the 'Help' perspective,
> 'Update' perspective etc.). Thank god those days are gone :-).
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Dejan Glozic, Ph.D.
> Manager, Eclipse Development 1A
> D1/R0Q/8200/MKM
> IBM Canada Ltd.
> Tel. 905 413-2745  T/L 969-2745
> Fax. 905 413-4850
> 
> 
> 
>                                                               
>              
>              "Philippe                                        
>              
>              Ombredanne"                                      
>              
>              <pombredanne@gmai                                
>           To 
>              l.com>                    "'Eclipse Platform 
> Update component 
>              Sent by:                  developers list.'"     
>              
>              platform-update-d         
> <platform-update-dev@xxxxxxxxxxx>   
>              ev-bounces@eclips                                
>           cc 
>              e.org                                            
>              
>                                                               
>      Subject 
>                                        RE: 
> [platform-update-dev]           
>              09/15/2006 02:06          Investigating some 
> alternative      
>              AM                        updatemanager          
>              
>                                                               
>              
>                                                               
>              
>              Please respond to                                
>              
>              "Eclipse Platform                                
>              
>              Update component                                 
>              
>              developers list."                                
>              
>              <platform-update-                                
>              
>              dev@xxxxxxxxxxx>                                 
>              
>                                                               
>              
>                                                               
>              
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ed:
> Can I quote that little snippet from your email on the wiki page?
> That is quite representative of a typical horror end user story.
> Now I am not sure we would be able to address that.
> Things like addressing issues with the launcher, the 
> startup.jar and the
> config.ini that you know well seesm to be in the plan in 3.3 at least.
> I do not intend to solve that for now.
> 
> > IMHO the biggest problem with the update manager today is it
> > can't update everything. Just the other day I was trying to
> > help a co-worker who reported that a plug-in I wrote wasn't
> > working. It turned out she was running Eclipse 3.0 and the
> > plug-in required 3.1 or 3.2. She had no idea she was running
> > a back-level version of Eclipse. "I've always run the update
> > manager", she said, "and I assumed it would update me". I
> > told her she had to install a whole new version of Eclipse so
> > she did, and of course she unpacked it right on top of the
> > old version before I could stop her. So I had her redo it in
> > a clean directory, but then she lost all the add-ins she had
> > collected (like CodePro) and had to reinstall those. This
> > kind of thing happens all the time. I know exactly why it
> > works this way but it's very user un-friendly.
> 
> You also said:
> > I wish I could help solve these problems with a code
> > contribution but all I have time for right now is to complain
> > about it and point to auto-updating programs like Firefox
> > that seem to have solved it already.
> We are trying to take the MacOS software update and the firefox theme
> and extensions updates as a model for a simple UI.
> Hopefully something to make you happy... yet keep expectations low.
> 
> A funny discussion we had was what should the UI look like?
> - a dialog?
> - a wizard?
> - a view?
> It looks like everyone I asked gave a different opinion.
> So the only we could agree on was that would be an SWT Composite ;-)
> Yet that compsite may be available either as a view or as a dialog.
> 
> What do you think?
> 
> --
> Cheers
> Philippe
> 
> philippe ombredanne | 1 650 799 0949 | pombredanne at nexb.com
> nexB - Open by Design (tm) - http://www.nexb.com
> http://easyeclipse.org  -  irc://irc.freenode.net/easyeclipse
> 
> 
> 
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: platform-update-dev-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx
> > [mailto:platform-update-dev-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of
> > Ed Burnette
> > Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2006 8:11 AM
> > To: Eclipse Platform Update component developers list.
> > Subject: RE: [platform-update-dev] Investigating some
> > alternative updatemanager
> >
> >
> > IMHO the biggest problem with the update manager today is it
> > can't update everything. Just the other day I was trying to
> > help a co-worker who reported that a plug-in I wrote wasn't
> > working. It turned out she was running Eclipse 3.0 and the
> > plug-in required 3.1 or 3.2. She had no idea she was running
> > a back-level version of Eclipse. "I've always run the update
> > manager", she said, "and I assumed it would update me". I
> > told her she had to install a whole new version of Eclipse so
> > she did, and of course she unpacked it right on top of the
> > old version before I could stop her. So I had her redo it in
> > a clean directory, but then she lost all the add-ins she had
> > collected (like CodePro) and had to reinstall those. This
> > kind of thing happens all the time. I know exactly why it
> > works this way but it's very user un-friendly.
> >
> > The second biggest problem with the update manager today is
> > it doesn't deal with different versions of plug-ins that are
> > targetted to different versions of Eclipse. Case in point. We
> > have an internal update site for plug-ins that employees have
> > written. Recently someone wanted to upgrade an older plug-in
> > to take advantage of a new feature in Eclipse 3.2. However
> > they couldn't because users are running various versions of
> > the Eclipse SDK including 3.0, 3.1, 3.2, or 3.3. And there's
> > also the case of new Eclipse versions breaking old plug-ins
> > that rely on internals (you know you write them). The manual
> > work-around of having a different URL for each version of the
> > SDK (updates/30, updates/31, etc.) is a pain to maintain and
> > get everyone to use it consistently and doesn't scale. There
> > should be a better way.
> >
> > I wish I could help solve these problems with a code
> > contribution but all I have time for right now is to complain
> > about it and point to auto-updating programs like Firefox
> > that seem to have solved it already. So if these kinds of
> > issues can be addressed with "Update manager - TNG", that
> > would be great.
> >
> > --Ed
> > www.pragmaticprogrammer.com/titles/ebgwt/
> > _______________________________________________
> > platform-update-dev mailing list
> > platform-update-dev@xxxxxxxxxxx
> > https://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/listinfo/platform-update-dev
> >
> 
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