Re: [platform-swt-dev] Support for JSR-198 (was SWT port for Swing!)

[Jim White <jim@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

Mike Wilson wrote:
> I really dislike the characterization of SWT as "not pure Java". The 
> truth of the matter is that, SWT is closer to being written in pure Java 
> than AWT is. At least in SWT, most of the interesting work is done above 
> the level of the natives.

There is a world of difference between Java binaries and native 
binaries.  And 100% Pure Java is not simply a marketing slogan.

I agree that the implementation approach used for the AWT toolkits in 
Sun's JDK & JRE was (and is) deeply flawed (ditto for most of the rest 
of the non-JVM code in the JDK).

I also agree SWT's approach to host system API and implementing the 
toolkit layer in Java is superior.  That is why I care about SWT at all, 
because I see it as important that Java adopt a standard method for 
writing code for the operating system-specific APIs.  Clearly it will 
benefit the GUI situation.

> The real problem, which you see as "pure Java-ness", is just that the 
> SWT libraries don't ship with the standard Java installs. It makes more 
> sense to attempt to fix that problem than it does to code an SWT on top 
> of AWT. Ugh.

I agree again.  That is going to require a JSR to go through the JCP. 
And part of that effort is bound to the requirement for a SWT 
implementation that is 100% Pure Java, at least back to the level of JDK 
1.2 compatibility (JDK 1.1 would be even better).

It will also require an AWT-SWT interoperability API that functions 
equivalently regardless of whether it is the SWT or AWT which is 
implemented natively (having both native is a special problem but 
certainly could use the same API).

Derek Anderson wrote:
> ... This project is open source. Please feel free to implement that
> feature you so desire, and contribute it back to the community. ...

I have been committed for many years to Open Source Java GUI API and was 
(am?) the Netscape DevEdge Champion for IFC.  It is/was a really great 
GUI and a builder tool that has yet to be surpassed.  Yet it died as 
result of bad decisions by both Sun and (I believe) IBM.  I'ld hate to 
see that happen to SWT, Java's last best hope for fixing the GUI.

http://developer.netscape.com/docs/manuals/ifc/home.html
http://developer.netscape.com/docs/manuals/ifc/constructor/index.html

My contribution to SWT/Eclipse was Motif and GTK+ ports for Mac OS X. 
They garnered no interest (and deservedly so I suppose):

http://www.pagesmiths.com/eclipse/

Jim