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[higgins-dev] Notes from August 7th Higgins developers call

Belated notes from the Higgins Developers call on Thursday, August 7





* Duane Buss - Novell

* Greg Byrd - NCSU/IBM

* Brian Carrol - Serena

* Tom Doman - Novell

* Andy Hodgkinson - Novell

* Ranjan Kumar - IBM

* David Kuehr-Mclaren - IBM

* Mike McIntosh - IBM 

*Drummond Reed - Cordance

Mary Ruddy - Meristic/SocialPhysics

* Markus Sabedello - Parity

* Jim Sermersheim - Novell

Paul Trevithick - Parity/SocialPhysics

Brian Walker - Parity

* Tom Caroll - Parity 

* Hank Mauldin - Cisco


* Attendees

Time: noon EDT (1700 London; 1800 Vienna, Paris, Berlin)
1-866-362-7064 / 892048#


1. [Brian] 1.1M3 completed on August 4.  Now working on 1.1M4.

2. [Brian] Nightly Auto-Test

3. [Brian & David] Internationalization

  • David to post  initial code to the dev list.          
  • See  http://wiki.eclipse.org/Internationalization_Support   
  • Still awaiting  approval of Ipzilla item  2515 for reuse of a subset of Equinox jar for dependency  
  • http://dev.eclipse.org/viewcvs/index.cgi/org.eclipse.osgi/supplement/src/org/eclipse/osgi/util/NLS.java   [Brian] The initial code was posed to the dev list.
  • [Mary] We are still waiting for official approval of the CQ for reuse of the subset of the equinox jar file.  I haven’t heard anything. Probably means one or more people are on vacation.
  • [Brian] Next piece is to identify the next candidate for updating to the new internationalization standard. I will follow-up with David offline about which components we should focus on next. 

4. [Mohamad] New Oracle-provided Google Contacts Context Provider

  • Can we get an overview of functionality?  
  • Does it implement each contact as a separate Entity?
  • [Mary] Mohamad is not on the call.  I sent him an email earlier, but haven’t heard back.  So Paul, you are up next.

5. [Paul] Review Higgins Overview PPT

  • http://www.eclipse.org/higgins/documents/Higgins-Overview-2008.ppt
  • [Paul] Focus is on Higgins 1.1.  This is an opportunity to get reactions to it.
  • [Paul] Does everyone have access to it? [the slides]
  • Silence
  • [Paul] So the first slides are just on Higgins 1.0.
  • [Paul] Slide 4, you can experience it though information cards. It is a place to start.
  • [Paul] Slide 5, have an introduction slide. Tried not to be too high level or too low level, it is an organizing point.
  • [Paul] Slide 7 is breezy, on Data Portability.
  • [Paul] Slide 8 is breezy.  It has been redone.
  • [Paul] Slide 9, is the same.
  • [Paul] Slide 10 is the same, but cleaned up. No new messaging.
  • [Paul] Please if anyone has an objections or comments…
  • [Paul] Slide 12 no new content,  1.0 supports two kinds of cards.  Managed and personal.
  • [Paul] Slide 13, three selectors.
  • [Paul] Slide 14, new
  • [Paul] Slide 15 – some selectors use an i-card service component
  • [Paul] Slide 16 seems redundant with 15, will fix.
  • [Paul] Slide 17 talks about the Higgins Selector Selector, which we have working.
  • [Paul] Slide 18, the IdP, there are two of these.
  • [Paul] Slide 19 shows where they fit in the world view.
  • [Paul] Slide 20, there are 2 of these.
  • [Paul] Slide 21, is about Relying Parties [RP’s].
  • [Paul] Slide 22 is where the RP’s live in the world
  • [Paul] Slide 23, is IBM’s Multi-protocol website enablement. Understand that it doesn’t support OpenID, there were just some licensing issues.
  • [Paul] Slide 24, Lego blocks and glue.  Gave it a generic name: Identity Services.
  • [Mike] Question about slide 23.  We have a website. Where is the multi-protocol website?  Can we put it on the slide?
  • [Paul] I should have said enablement library.  I’m open for some IBMer to give it a better name.
  • [??] If we had places to show case, we should add URL’s to actual IdP’s and RP’s
  • [?] Sounds like a good idea.
  • [Paul] Slide 24, there is all this glue.
  • [Paul] Slide 25, glue used by apps and selector.  It is pluggable. And this is one place where we can plug things in. ..
  • [Paul] Slide 26, we all know that it isn’t really layered like this.
  • [?] On slide 25 what are the different colors?
  • [Paul] White is being considered. Orange is done. This is to give hint of the future without committing.
  • [Paul] Slide 27 shows that IdAS is pluggable.  The same key is missing here.
  • [Hank] I noticed the way the plug-in differs.  In an earlier diagram had them mapping to OpenID, etc. Now you have eliminated that one level. Is this intentional?
  • [Paul]  What I did is make slides 25 and 27. Used to be one side, which was too complex.  So I introduced an arbitrary distinction.
  • [Hank] Before 25 and 27 where both pointed to IdAS.
  • [phone problems]
  • [Paul] I do not think that I really changed where they plugged in.  I split one slide into two.
  • [Hank] I remember IdAS in the middle:  API  above and  below.
  • [Paul] I may have eliminated OpenID as a CP type as Novell did that work and it was a bit experimental, and there doesn’t seem to be a lot of pull for that
  • [Hank] You showed OpenID in 25. I don’t remember both layers having plug-ins
  • [Paul] Slide 27 is accurate.  I took liberties in slide 25. These plug-ins plug into multiple components. Some into the STS, some in a different place.  So I just used dashed white lines. This one doesn’t show much detail of the architecture.
  • [Hank] Fine.  Just trying to relate to what you had before.
  • [Paul] Slide 28 is an intro to IdAS. As is slide 29 and talking about potential of globally linked data.
  • [Paul] Slide 31.  Took a little liberty.  All these aps are involved in interoperability somewhere. So when we participate in an OSIS Interop some things we bring are selector, RP and IdP code. Was a way to capture that notion and provide intro or 32 and 33.
  • [Paul] The next part may be more controversial.  Higgins 1.1.  I took the liberty to change the date.  At next F2F should take some time for planning.
  • [Paul] Slide 36, Jim, I’m sure…
  • [Jim] June 2009, is that the date of this presentation or of 1.1?
  • [Paul] I felt Spring coming quickly so changed to June for 1.1.  Haven’t discussed this much.  It is to be discussed..
  • [ah, definitely,…]
  • [Paul] All things being equal, there is a bias to June release dates as that is when they have the Eclipse release train.
  • [Paul] Slide 36, Jim, you could send me some additional points to make here and on any other slide you want?
  • [Jim] ok.
  • [Paul] Slide 37.  OpenSocial has been discussed. Maybe Oracle would do that too. There have been discussions of ID-WSF wrappers.  There are maybes on things that are not yet resourced.
  • [Paul] Slide 38.  Parity folks and Markus have been working on that.  Relationship cards are the next section.  Just tidied-up the slide.  It is not new.
  • [Paul] Slide 43 is interesting.  We in Parity have been working on something that Mike and I have discussed in the past:  A password card.  Would be great to discuss at the F2F.  You use it to log into regular passwords sites.  Also, not in the slide deck, form filling anti- fishing support for OpenID RP’s, auto fill in your favorite OpenID, check the redirect…similar to what VeriSign did with the seatbelt plug-in. I’ve recently been told that OpenID has been working on OpenID support. Then would have ability to login into OpenID, Information card and regular sites.  Then the only thing missing is SAML. Then it would be really neat, we could log in anywhere.
  • [Paul] We talked about doing a SAML card, being able to fetch a token using a SAML protocol over the wire.
  • [Paul] I know there is an idmix token type. It might be worthy of being a card also.
  • [Paul] Slide 44.  This is something that Parity folks have been working on very hard for 1.1.  A set of i-card handing under your OpenID. It is your internet wide user name and password. You can also use it as a way to authenticate to your selector. In particular, a hosted selector that can be registered as a service endpoint, assuming the OpenID is an OpenID 2.0. Not sure how much of the code had been checked in yet.  Drummond had designed a protocol.  People didn’t really own their own OpenID. You can’t add new service types to it unless you run your own service.  Have worked on a proposal to have a service end point provisioner.  Did I say…
  • [Drummond] Yup.
  •  [Paul] Markus tell us about your free XRI hat.
  • [Markus] I run this free provider for i-names. You can register your i-name there. Has forwarding service and in addition can do what Paul just described.  It can act as a user name for your selector. The protocol is to download selector, run it and in the process of installing the selector you choose an i-name, an OpenID and it is provisioned with the appropriate end point. Then can use it just like any OpenID and is also a user name for a selector.
  • [Paul] The next slide is another maybe.  Actually Dale, Mary, Charles and I were just on a call with this French consortium. It is just one of the groups interested in having Higgins support ID-WSF.
  • [Dale] It is interesting that they even want to move to info cards, it really evolutionary..
  • [Paul] Moreover, it is  interesting work.
  • [Dale] Yah.  I agree.
  • [Paul] I hope resources fall out of the sky so we can move on with this.
  • [Paul] Slide 46 is something that Markus has been work on.
  • [Markus] The IdAS client?
  • [Paul] Yes.
  • [Markus] That is way of using IdAS without needing a lot of context providers that you would normally need. If you want to open a context, it doesn’t open it directly. Instead it sends the request to an IdAS server that opens the client provider, so the client doesn’t need to have the CP. The server has the CP. So it can read and write without knowing what is behind it and needing a [local] CP.
  • [Paul] It was written in java.  Have experimented with cross compiling it into c code. 
  • [Markus] It worked. I was able to write a simple c program to remotely open a context and read data.
  • [Jim] It does sound similar to the IdAS.cp.res.xml provider that we have been quietly working on.  It is checked in and on the components page.
  • [Paul] Can you make a slide for that or send me some stuff?
  • [David] Likewise, we have been working on restful API’s as well.
  • [Paul] Is that checked in?
  • [David] It is not checked in.
  • ……..
  • [Paul] Beyond Higgins 1.1, a pet project a lot of people talk to me about is hand held devices.  IBM showed a prototype in January of an Android Selector.  It is not checked in, but there might be other efforts that would get underway.
  • [Paul] Slide 49,  I took the liberty of moving the goals of the project to the end, as they are sort of boring.  They are just a lot of words.
  • [Paul] Thank you for the feedback.  Do send in your new slides.
  • [Paul] What is next on the agenda?

6. [Paul] Next Higgins F2F

  • We had suggested having a F2F just after DIDW, but there wasn’t a lot of energy around that. So another idea might be having a F2F before or after IIW (November, Mountain View)
  • IIW: http://iiw.idcommons.net/index.php/Main_Page <-- see IIW fall
  • DIDW:  http://public.cxo.com/conferences/index.html?conferenceID=24   
  • Old DIDW doodle: http://www.doodle.ch/n5ndur33y5nz6kqw  
  • [Mary] The Face-to-Face.
  • [Paul]  There didn’t seem to be much interest in having it at DIDW. I know from another TC call, that at last one of the IBM’ers will be at IIW.  Should we set up a Doodle for that? Or maybe we could take a temperature.
  • [Mary] Yes.
  • [Paul] Maybe take temperature.  Maybe 3 days or  2 day.  Ideally more than 1 1/ 2 days.  See how many people may be going to IIW. Are you and other Novel folks going to IIW?
  • [Jim] I suspect yes. Not sure. Haven’t planned resource to go to that yet.  We will have someone at EAC.  Don’t know yet. Planning the F2F will help us to plan.
  • [Dale]  I find it strange IIW is the same days as the Gartner summit.
  • [Paul] Maybe that isn’t so bad.  We would just have it before or after, rather than at the same time.
  • [?] Where is Gartner?
  • [?] Orlando
  • [Paul] Opposite coasts.
  • [Paul] So Mary will send out some Doodles.  How long, where and what dates.
  • [Paul] I do think we should have another F2F.  I think May was the last one.  There is actually a lot of stuff going on
  • [Paul] That is it for me.  Anything else anyone wants to bring up?
  • Silence
  • [Paul] Great.  See you all next week.