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Re: [equinox-dev] provisioning self hosting


My biggest problem at the time was that I was running eclipse in ways I had not had to before:
- I usually run Eclipse application (workbench) launches, and using those OSGI and test launch configs was kind of bizarre.
- If the data is not set up propertly you get those RepositoryCreation/FileNotFound exceptions and then it's like...hmmm..what do I do now?
- I got confused by the startup sequence.  I had to manually start the bundles in my code the first time in order to get a provisioning console, but after that they were resumed, so the sequence and timing of getting those exceptions changed.  I'm not an OSGi hacker so I really didn't know how to diagnose or figure out how to debug things going on in startup.  
If the code could more gracefully handle missing xml files that would be a start (if there's no content.xml can we just assume an empty repository?)

Also the existing doc kind of scared me off, with all the discussion of workspace left/middle/right.  I'm still not sure I'm clear on the extra indirection of the "middle" workspace.   I think it would have been better to explain things a bit better, and in particular how often/necessary it is to update the provisioning code in workspace left if you are updating it in workspace middle.  As far as I understand, workspace middle is only necessary so that workspace right can be launched in the right way?  Or perhaps I still don't quite get it.

And...finally.. I think the terminology is a bit misleading because "self hosting" might imply "self provisioning" which we can do in a self hosting workspace, but not necessarily.

I would be happy to discuss one on one if you think it's helpful, as I was ignorant of all things provisioning and OSGI coming into this...

susan


Jeff McAffer <Jeff_McAffer@xxxxxxxxxx>
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07/23/2007 08:56 AM
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Not sure I understand.  If one is writing some system that calls the provisioning API, they need to selfhost.  Such a person may have no interest in how provisioning works, writing tools for it, ...  They simply want to call the code to have things installed at runtime.  An example would be someone porting TOAST to use the new provisioning stuff.  They had their own provisioning, then put it one Update Manager and now want to put it on the new provisioning system.   They develop bundles that have nothing to do with provisioning but when they run they need to be able to dynamically install them without having to "deploy" or generate metadata manually or...  Code and run.


The proviisoning Geting Started page is targetted at people looking to get started with the provisioning code.  By definition it seems then that they fall into the groups you have identified plus the folks I pointed out.  Who else would be reading the getting started page?


BTW, I have no problem splitting up the page but am not clear on how to do that.

Jeff



Pascal Rapicault/Ottawa/IBM@IBMCA
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07/23/2007 09:02 AM

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Re: [equinox-dev] provisioning self hosting







I helped Andrew O. with the self hosting setup and what became apparent at
that time was this is *not* a getting started scenario for someone just
willing to step through an installation. This setup is interesting for two
groups of people, the tool smiths willing to understand how provisioning
and PDE will be reconciliated in 3.4, and people willing to setup complex
provisioning scenario without writing metadata manually. However those
expectations were not clear, and scared people away from provisioning.

Rather than building up this page I would appreciate if you could split the
self hosting doc into its separate page.

PaScaL


                                                                         
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In looking through provisioning bug reports recently there have been a few
cases where people have expressed frustration or problems with their
selfhosting setup.    The configuration is currently quite sensitive but
does seem to work quite well if you know how to care for it.  A while ago I
took a stab at a selfhosting How-to on the wiki

http://wiki.eclipse.org/Equinox_Provisioning_Getting_Started#Setting_up_selfhosting

This is pretty bare bones and does not have some level of detail needed in
real life (e.g., the metadata locations to delete in case of problems etc)

Since selfhosting is so central to the development workflow, it would be
great to refine the steps in the howto and hightlight the pitfalls/cures.
What I propose is to work with anyone and everyone who is having
selfhosting problems and then document the problems and solutions as well
enhance the steps based on feedback.

It might be most effective if we simply scheduled a selfhosting call and
people with problems/contributions could dial in.  Alternatively, we could
use part of the regular provisioning call (if there are alot of people
interested/having problems).  Alternatively, if there are only a few
people, one on one might work.

Thoughts?

Jeff _______________________________________________
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