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Re: [e4-dev] e4 tools build moving to Luna?

Hi,

I never received an answer to this mail, does no one have a opinion on this? Is anyone still interested in this topic?

Best Regards

Jonas


Am 20.01.2014 19:35, schrieb Jonas Helming:
Hi,

for me the relavant questions are:

1. Which bundles to we want to graduate and move?

IMHO, the Application Model Editor and the e4 project wizards would be most important and already a huge improvement of the situation. Everybody who wants to create a native e4 applications needs this editor.
Far behind, I would consider th CSS editor, but I think it would be acceptable to still install this one.

2. Where do we want to move it?

Until now, most people mentioned, that the e4 tools should be moved to PDE. I personally would prefer to move them to the platform. The editor is really closely connected to the platform, it even accesses some internal API. The editor must also evolve in parallel to the Application Model. Finally I think the developers of the plattform are more connected to the tools.

3. What do we need to do to make this happen?

I think we should identify the shortest path to a good result.

- I don't think it is essential that the editor provides a public API. Extending it is a rather advanced use cases. If people extended a non-graduated tool in the past, I think they can live with internal API or SPI in the future. From an API stability point of view, this does not make a difference.
- We need to check, which bundles must be moved. I am worried most about org.eclipse.e4.tools.services,  it contains parts, which are not only used by the Application Model editor. So we might need to move some things around.
- We need to define our goals for documentation and test coverage

Finally I do not think this will slow down the evolution of the tools. If people want to contribute, they can still do. In turn, I think it makes it easier and more visible to create native e4 applications.

What do you think?

Cheers

Jonas

P.S.: Doug, thanks fro pushing this forward, I think an opinion from a user point of view is very valuable for this discussion



Am 20.01.2014 18:18, schrieb Doug Schaefer:
These tools are equals to the plugin.xml and *.product editors. Not sure what you are getting at below. I’m pretty sure users who need these tools really don’t get it.

Doug.

From: David M Williams <david_williams@xxxxxxxxxx>
Reply-To: E4 Project developer mailing list <e4-dev@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Date: Monday, January 20, 2014 at 10:30 AM
To: E4 Project developer mailing list <e4-dev@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [e4-dev] e4 tools build moving to Luna?

Sorry if this is obvious to others, but is this tool intended to be a "delivery" of the "e4/sdk" product? In the sense it has APIs and/or could be extended? Or it is intended for use only by "Eclipse committers" in making Eclipse IDE?

I ask since the "requirements" are quite a bit different for the two. If simply a "releng tool" it could be provided similar to how we deliver the "releng tools" from Platform (which provides copyright tools, and a validator for MANIFEST and POM versions (and some old cvs 'release' tools not used much these days). While the description is needs improvement, I think it's pretty clear it is not intended to provide API or be extended (therefore "compatibility", etc. is not considered that important ... we tell people to use the same version built with their dev. environment.

But, if meant to be extendable, and provide API, etc, then there are higher criteria.

I should add, it would be "hard" to "build with the SDK" because it depends on some emf components (such as emf.edit.ui?) which is not apart of the "base" EMF we get "early" from EMF.

Hope these comments help inform the final decision.




From:        John Arthorne <John_Arthorne@xxxxxxxxxx>
To:        E4 Project developer mailing list <e4-dev@xxxxxxxxxxx>,
Date:        01/19/2014 11:11 AM
Subject:        Re: [e4-dev] e4 tools build moving to Luna?
Sent by:        e4-dev-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx




If  parts of the e4 tools graduated into PDE, then all active contributors to those tools would be granted PDE commit rights as part of the graduation/restructuring. We did the same thing with commit rights on other parts of e4 that graduated into the platform. So I don't think commit rights will be a problem at all. It does of course require active committers to keep maintaining it wherever it ends up.

John




From:        
Lars Vogel <lars.vogel@xxxxxxxxx>
To:        
E4 Project developer mailing list <e4-dev@xxxxxxxxxxx>,
Date:        
01/18/2014 05:02 AM
Subject:        
Re: [e4-dev] e4 tools build moving to Luna?
Sent by:        
e4-dev-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx




I personally like that we can adjust the tooling as needed. PDE seems very inactive at the moment.

But test, better Javadoc and fixing the outstanding bugs is good in general, no matter if the tools get officially released or not, so no need to hold such activities of.

Best regards, Lars

Am 18.01.2014 09:40 schrieb "Wim Jongman" <wim.jongman@xxxxxxxxx>:
There are things missing in the model editor and in the tooling in general. Most notably unit tests, javadoc and user documentation. We need to fix these before a release can be considered.  

I am also happy to join a dedicated team that tackles this. So that makes two. Who wants to join us?

Regards,

Wim


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