RE: [e4-dev] modernizing the workbench visual design

["Toedter, Kai" <kai.toedter@xxxxxxxxxxx>]

Elias,

I agree with you and actually I am a Windows user and like your Ribbon approach very much. Do you know if there are any legal issues that had to be clarified with Microsoft for using a Ribbon-like design at all? 

And, I am not sure about the question how platform independent the basic e4 look & feel should be. What I like right now, is that I could use Eclipse easily on Mac or Linux without since the basic design is the same.

But I really would love to see a less cluttered, modern UI :)

Best wishes,

Kai

> -----Original Message-----
> From: e4-dev-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:e4-dev-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx] On
> Behalf Of Elias Volanakis
> Sent: Donnerstag, 3. Dezember 2009 20:54
> To: E4 Project developer mailing list
> Subject: Re: [e4-dev] modernizing the workbench visual design and
> remaining a good platform citizen
> 
> One of the things I personally would like to see is a less cluttered
> UI, with less menu elements, toolbar elements and local toolbars (see
> Netbeans). Eclipse seems overloaded to me. Personally I also find the
> "gray" look dated and does faring well compared with recent apps, esp
> on Windows 7.
> 
> Some ideas:
> 
> - having something like the Ribbon would help
> 
> In my leisure time I've been working on a prototype running based on
> Eclipse 3.5.x and the Ribbon from Hexapixel
> (http://hexapixel.com/projects/ribbon). See some screenshots below for
> a rough idea - I would like to have even less stuff on there in the
> final version. I find that having less menus and toolbar elements makes
> Eclipse more usable to me - very much comparable to the improvements in
> office when compared with the "old" office. The argument that the
> Ribbon takes up more space is not valid, as the Ribbon can be collapsed
> and the most frequently items are in the window toolbar. So it ends up
> using less space.
> 
> Looking forward I would very much like to see SWT support the native
> Windows Ribbon that is part of Windows 7. I think that the licencing
> situation would be different for that than for an emulated Ribbon, so
> it is fair to re-open this discussion.
> 
> - the unused space on the right side of the toolbar could be used for
> some ambient notifications like build results, test results
> (green/red), news/stream (twitter, recent commits). I don't have this
> working yet.
> 
> - making the local view toolbars hidden by default and having to click
> something to show them. I find that 99% of the time I don't touch the
> local view toolbars so they are wasting space. I'm working towards
> adding the most frequently used local toolbar elements to the main
> toolbar and making the view toolbars hidden by default.
> 
> - modern theming, less grayness, for example the semi transparent Aero-
> look would fit better with Windows 7.
> 
> Curious to hear more ideas,
> Elias.
> 
> On Thu, Dec 3, 2009 at 8:31 AM, Susan Franklin McCourt
> <susan_franklin@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> > Hi, everyone.
> > We had a brief discussion on the e4 call about this topic and thought
> > it would be good to make sure everyone is aware of it.
> >
> > We are currently working with a graphic designer to modernize the
> > style of the Eclipse 4.0 workbench. That is, what is the default
> > stylesheet for the Eclipse SDK running on e4?
> >
> > One of the more interesting constraints, which we've always had in
> > Eclipse, is balancing the desire for a custom/modern UI with respect
> > for platform look and feel, and the user's platform theme. In Eclipse
> > 3.x, we've done this by using native widgets in most places, and
> > looking up system colors as a reference point when choosing colors.
> >
> > For e4, we still walk this line. Sure, we will have the technology to
> > completely reskin the workbench, and folks are free to do so. But for
> > the default look, I believe we will still be balancing these
> concerns.
> > We may take more leeway in applying gradients, changing tab shapes,
> > using background images or shading, but all of this should be done
> > while still blending with the platform theme choices.
> >
> > CSS support presents a new wrinkle. It's not good enough to simply
> > make the right color choices for the workbench. Sure, we can do the
> > math internally and pick the right colors. But it would be ideal if
> we
> > could provide developers with the ability to style their own
> > applications in this platform respecting way, and include web
> > components that could blend nicely. Since CSS is RGB-based for color
> > attributes, we're looking at ways to specify a more HSV-style color
> > for elements, where the hue could optionally be ignored and instead
> be
> > derived from platform theme colors. Note we aren't just talking about
> > background colors for images and gradients. We'd like to be able to
> > specify widget colors in this way. How should this be specified in a
> stylesheet?
> >
> > Surely someone has already given some thought to this problem. If you
> > have ideas, please comment in this bug! [1] A more general discussion
> > of the visual design work can be found here. [2] And watching this
> bug
> > [3] will ensure you see mockups when there is something to show.
> >
> > thanks,
> > susan
> >
> > [1] https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=296175
> > [2] http://wiki.eclipse.org/E4/CSS/Visual_Design
> > [3] https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=293481
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > e4-dev mailing list
> > e4-dev@xxxxxxxxxxx
> > https://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/listinfo/e4-dev
> >
> >
> 
> 
> 
> --
> Elias Volanakis | Technical Lead | http://eclipsesource.com
> elias@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx | +1 503 929 5537 | @evolanakis