RE: [cdt-dev] RE: [dsdp-dd-dev] Editor technology subgroup

[Doug Schaefer <DSchaefer@xxxxxxx>]

Which Doug is everyone talking about :).

Since the Greg's note was sent to cdt-dev, I thought it was for me. This
note sounds like it is for Doug G...

Doug Schaefer, QNX Software Systems
Eclipse CDT Project Lead, Tools PMC member
http://cdtdoug.blogspot.com
 

-----Original Message-----
From: cdt-dev-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:cdt-dev-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx] On
Behalf Of Mikhail Khodjaiants
Sent: Friday, May 12, 2006 11:35 AM
To: CDT General developers list.
Subject: Re: [cdt-dev] RE: [dsdp-dd-dev] Editor technology subgroup

Doug,

There was a special group formed among others at the last DSDP meeting to 
work on the design of the debug model. I volunteered to participate, but I 
haven't heard anything since. You mentioned that Pavel and Ted are doing 
some work in this direction. Is there any new information available on what 
they are doing?

Thanks,
Mikhail Khodjaiants
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Greg Watson" <g.watson@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: "CDT General developers list." <cdt-dev@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Friday, May 12, 2006 11:11 AM
Subject: Re: [cdt-dev] RE: [dsdp-dd-dev] Editor technology subgroup


> Doug,
>
> I wonder if we could be involved in the design of the next generation 
> debugger model? We're also looking at how to use the flexible debug  model

> for the parallel debugger. Since we reused considerable  portions of CDT 
> debugger functionality in the parallel debugger  implementation, it would 
> make sense to try and combine efforts here.
>
> Greg
>
> On May 12, 2006, at 8:19 AM, Doug Schaefer wrote:
>
>> BTW, Welcome Toni!
>>
>> We've been in need of some focus on the CDT editor for a while and  I 
>> look
>> forward to your contributions.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Doug Schaefer, QNX Software Systems
>> Eclipse CDT Project Lead, Tools PMC member
>> http://cdtdoug.blogspot.com
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: dsdp-dd-dev-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx
>> [mailto:dsdp-dd-dev-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Gaff, Doug
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 10, 2006 2:43 PM
>> To: Device Debugging developer discussions
>> Cc: Leherbauer, Anton; CDT General developers list.
>> Subject: RE: [dsdp-dd-dev] Editor technology subgroup
>>
>> Hi folks,
>>
>> I've asked Toni Leherbauer from my team to provide input on the  editor.
>> Toni is currently looking at enhancing the CDT editor and is  collecting
>> some features on the CDT project plan.
>> http://wiki.eclipse.org/index.php/CDT/planning/4.0
>>
>> Since there is interest in the editor in both the CDT and DD projects,
>> we should keep both groups in the loop.  And of course, we should have
>> one editor solution in the end (in CDT).  We started discussing  this in
>> the DD project in Toronto simply as a way to capture requirements as
>> they related to debugging.
>>
>> Also, as I mentioned on the recent DD call, Ted and Pawel are  working on
>> a prototype for a generic debugger implementation of the Eclipse 3.2
>> debug model interfaces (EDMI 3.2 for short).  The goal is that this
>> prototype will form the basis of a next-generation debugger model that
>> benefits folks using CDT and folks working directly with the Eclipse
>> platform today.  We intend to get this committed in the next few weeks
>> so that the community can start discussing architecture,  interfaces, and
>> requirements.
>>
>> So regarding the editor, I see open questions around how we integrate
>> disassembly, breakpoints, instruction pointers, etc. with a new  debugger
>> implementation.  I am also wondering how the editor will deal with
>> multiple debug engines simultaneously (for example, how to set the
>> default breakpoint scope).
>>
>> Doug
>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: dsdp-dd-dev-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:dsdp-dd-dev-
>>> bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Doug Schaefer
>>> Sent: Wednesday, May 10, 2006 2:18 PM
>>> To: Device Debugging developer discussions
>>> Subject: RE: [dsdp-dd-dev] Editor technology subgroup
>>>
>>> Well, the Using Visual C++ 5 book that I have in front of me right
>> now,
>>> copyright 1997, shows their Disassembly View which interleaves source
>> and
>>> disassembly.
>>>
>>> Mind you it's a view and not an editor. But then, why would you edit
>> in
>>> this
>>> window? Does the assembly get updated based on the source changes you
>>> make?
>>> Can you edit the assembly and have the source updated? (That'd be
>> cool,
>>> BTW
>>> :).
>>>
>>> What was the original use case again?
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> Doug Schaefer, QNX Software Systems
>>> Eclipse CDT Project Lead, Tools PMC member
>>> http://cdtdoug.blogspot.com
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: dsdp-dd-dev-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx
>>> [mailto:dsdp-dd-dev-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Recoskie, Chris
>>> Sent: Wednesday, May 10, 2006 1:30 PM
>>> To: Device Debugging developer discussions
>>> Subject: RE: [dsdp-dd-dev] Editor technology subgroup
>>>
>>> I'm guessing the person I was talking to was referring to US patent #
>>> 6,493,868.  Like I said I'm not a patent lawyer so I'm not going to
>>> comment as to whether or not it is truly applicable or not.  It seems
>>> very broad and I'm not sure of the rules as to how it does or does  not
>>> apply to specific features in IDEs.
>>>
>>> Anyway take a look and due your due diligence.  It may be a non  issue.
>>>
>>>
>>> =====================
>>>
>>>
>>> United States Patent  6,493,868
>>> DaSilva ,   et al.  December 10, 2002
>>>
>>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- 
>> --
>>> --------
>>> Integrated development tool
>>>
>>>
>>> Abstract
>>> An integrated code development tool, comprising of an editor, a
>> project
>>> management and build system, a debugger, a profiler, and a graphical
>>> data visualization system. The editor is operable to provide a source
>>> code view which is simultaneously capable of integrating with said
>>> debugger to provide for stepping through code and setting  breakpoints,
>>> and integrating with the output of said build system to display  source
>>> code interleaved with corresponding assembler code created by said
>> build
>>> system.
>>>
>>>
>>> ___________________________________________
>>>
>>> Chris Recoskie
>>> Software Designer
>>> Texas Instruments, Toronto
>>> http://eclipse.org/cdt
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: dsdp-dd-dev-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:dsdp-dd-dev-
>>>> bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of John Cortell
>>>> Sent: Wednesday, May 10, 2006 11:51 AM
>>>> To: Device Debugging developer discussions
>>>> Subject: RE: [dsdp-dd-dev] Editor technology subgroup
>>>>
>>>> If this is true, it's extremely surprising. Interleaved
>>>> source/disassemble is a staple in many debuggers. How a company
>> would
>>>> go about successfully patenting the implementation of such a feature
>>>> in an open source product is puzzling, to say the least.
>> Copyrighting
>>>> an implementation is one thing; patenting the idea is another story.
>>>>
>>>> John
>>>>
>>>> At 10:28 AM 5/10/2006, Recoskie, Chris wrote:
>>>>> A caveat:
>>>>>
>>>>> I have heard that TI holds a patent on showing interleaved
>>>>> source/disassembly in the editor window (but not in other windows,
>> so
>>>>> the current Disassembly View does not infringe this patent as I
>>>>> understand it).  I don't think it would be any sort of problem to
>> get
>>>>> this patent licensed royalty-free to Eclipse for such a feature,
>> but
>>> it
>>>>> is an IP issue that will have to go through due diligence for sure.
>>>>>
>>>>> Disclaimer:  I am not a patent lawyer and I have no authority to
>>> license
>>>>> the aforementioned patent, if it exists, on behalf of TI.
>>>>>
>>>>> ___________________________________________
>>>>>
>>>>> Chris Recoskie
>>>>> Software Designer
>>>>> Texas Instruments, Toronto
>>>>> http://eclipse.org/cdt
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>> From: dsdp-dd-dev-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:dsdp-dd-dev-
>>>>>> bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of John Cortell
>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, May 10, 2006 9:19 AM
>>>>>> To: Device Debugging developer discussions;
>>> dsdp-dd-dev@xxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>> Subject: Re: [dsdp-dd-dev] Editor technology subgroup
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Ewa,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> What are the BV bug numbers? They're not Bugzilla reports from
>>> what I
>>>>> can
>>>>>> tell.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I entered a bugzilla report for "Jump to Line" a while back
>>>>>>
>>>>>>          https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=118147
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> We are also very interested in mixed disassembler/source mode
>>>>>> debugging. It seems this would be best implemented if indeed all
>>>>>> three modes are provided in the editor. Your suggested approach
>>> seems
>>>>>> feasible to me; the debugger could generate files on the fly.
>> The
>>>>>> trick would be to make that  approach look natural to the user,
>> so
>>>>>> he's not aware that he's looking at a temporary file.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> John
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> At 08:46 PM 5/9/2006, Ewa Matejska wrote:
>>>>>>> Hi,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I'm soliciting ideas for enhancements to the Editor to  improve
>>> the
>>>>>>> embedded development experience.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Possible ideas are:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 1. Add the "Jump to Line" option the editor margin menu.
>>> BV118147.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 2. Merge the Disassembly view into the Editor.  This could be
>>>>>>> achieved in having a special read-only debug file for each
>> debug
>>>>>>> session whose state would toggle between source, disassembly
>> and
>>>>>>> mixed in some way. Related bug is BV39644.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> These ideas will be captured at:
>>>>>>> http://wiki.eclipse.org/index.php/DSDP/DD/Editor
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Chris Recoskie, as the lead of the Disassembly View, what do
>> you
>>>>>>> think of idea#2?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Thank You,
>>>>>>> Ewa.
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> dsdp-dd-dev mailing list
>>>>>>> dsdp-dd-dev@xxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>>> https://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/listinfo/dsdp-dd-dev
>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> dsdp-dd-dev mailing list
>>>>>> dsdp-dd-dev@xxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>> https://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/listinfo/dsdp-dd-dev
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> dsdp-dd-dev mailing list
>>>>> dsdp-dd-dev@xxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>> https://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/listinfo/dsdp-dd-dev
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
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>
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